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Toronto Crosstown LRT | ?m | ?s | Metrolinx | Arcadis

Avenue said:
I don't get why Crosstown West speeds would be reduced. It has a fixed route, no turning, no racing with the rest of the traffic. Transit drivers are incredibly careful, well trained, never distracted, etc. It's overall extremely unlikely to hit pedestrians and there's little reducing speeds can mitigate.
Click to expand...

It would be reduced because street-running vehicles need to abide by the posted speed limit. The purpose of reducing the speed limit is so that when a collision occurs, the collision is less likely to be fatal for the pedestrian. I personally know someone who spent a lengthy stint in rehab after being hit by a Spadina streetcar, so it does happen, regardless of what you may think.

This is one of the advantages of complete grade separation: complete segregation means that it can go at whatever speed it wants.
 
aquateam said:
It would be reduced because street-running vehicles need to abide by the posted speed limit. The purpose of reducing the speed limit is so that when a collision occurs, the collision is less likely to be fatal for the pedestrian. I personally know someone who spent a lengthy stint in rehab after being hit by a Spadina streetcar, so it does happen, regardless of what you may think.

This is one of the advantages of complete grade separation: complete segregation means that it can go at whatever speed it wants.
Click to expand...

I don't think pedestrians should be encouraged to cross LRT tracks apart from controlled intersections. Otherwise no speed limit can help.
 
Avenue said:
I don't think pedestrians should be encouraged to cross LRT tracks apart from controlled intersections. Otherwise no speed limit can help.
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But even if the tracks were fenced off in between intersections, the problem spots are still the intersections. If you're going 150 km/hour in a tunnel/in the sky that's fine, but you can't barrel through intersections at that speed, even if you have a green light.

Again, the purpose of the speed limit isn't just to prevent collisions from occurring since someone can always dart out, hidden behind an oncoming streetcar. The purpose of the reduced speed limits is to reduce the impacts when they inevitably do occur. The road system needs to allow for human error, so that a moment of inattentiveness isn't a death sentence. At least that's the goal of vision zero.
 
So now we are no longer just fear mongering pedestrian safety but also the idea that possibly in the future eglinton might get a lower speed limit which might slow down the lrt. The list of fake bs excuses to justify ones transit fantasies is unending.
 
sixrings said:
So now we are no longer just fear mongering pedestrian safety but also the idea that possibly in the future eglinton might get a lower speed limit which might slow down the lrt. The list of fake bs excuses to justify ones transit fantasies is unending.
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Speed limits impact travel time, and there is a real and not-negligible chance that Eglinton would have its speed limit reduced (despite your characterization as "fearmongering" and "fake bullshit".) Especially since City planning has this bizarre vision of Eglinton west as being "just like St. Clair", speed limits will likely be reduced to improve the pedestrian experience.

Lower speed limits part of Toronto plan to reduce pedestrian deaths
(this is targeted at specific arterials across the city, not a blanket limit, but the fact that a center-right car-centric mayor proposes this shows what could happen if we get a more downtown left-wing mayor)

Reduced speed limits part of Tory's 'master plan' to improve road safety

Lower Toronto speed limits by 10 to 20 km/h to protect pedestrians, chief medical officer says
Dr. David McKeown advocates a 30 km/h speed limit on residential streets and a citywide speed limit of 40 km/h on all other streets

Life in the not-so-fast lane: Montreal to reduce speed limits by 2019
Montreal drivers are going to have to hit the brakes as Mayor Denis Coderre announced plans to reduce speed limits on many of the city’s streets.

The new limits will be:

  • 30 km-per-hour on residential streets, in school zones, in front of playgrounds and on commercial streets with one lane in each direction.
  • 30 km-per-hour in Old Montreal, with some roads having a limit of 20 km-per-hour.
  • 40 km-per-hour in industrial areas and on the main arteries of the city centre.
  • 50 km-per-hour on the main arteries of sectors outside the city centre

CITY OF MONTREAL MULLS OVER REDUCING SPEED LIMITS ACROSS THE ISLAND
SkyTrain-vs-LRT-speeds-300x140@2x.png



However, I don't think the reduced top speed would have as much of an impact on travel times as all the red lights that it needs to stop at.

Elevated sections are not unusual for LRTs. For instance, here is Calgary's "new" (2012) west LRT :
Elevated-Guideway2-full.jpg

13_1298565266.jpg



Calgary-West-LRT.jpg
 
aquateam said:
Speed limits impact travel time, and there is a real and not-negligible chance that Eglinton would have its speed limit reduced (despite your characterization as "fearmongering" and "fake bullshit".) Especially since City planning has this bizarre vision of Eglinton west as being "just like St. Clair", speed limits will likely be reduced to improve the pedestrian experience.

Lower speed limits part of Toronto plan to reduce pedestrian deaths
(this is targeted at specific arterials across the city, not a blanket limit, but the fact that a center-right car-centric mayor proposes this shows what could happen if we get a more downtown left-wing mayor)

Reduced speed limits part of Tory's 'master plan' to improve road safety

Lower Toronto speed limits by 10 to 20 km/h to protect pedestrians, chief medical officer says
Dr. David McKeown advocates a 30 km/h speed limit on residential streets and a citywide speed limit of 40 km/h on all other streets

Life in the not-so-fast lane: Montreal to reduce speed limits by 2019
Montreal drivers are going to have to hit the brakes as Mayor Denis Coderre announced plans to reduce speed limits on many of the city’s streets.

The new limits will be:

  • 30 km-per-hour on residential streets, in school zones, in front of playgrounds and on commercial streets with one lane in each direction.
  • 30 km-per-hour in Old Montreal, with some roads having a limit of 20 km-per-hour.
  • 40 km-per-hour in industrial areas and on the main arteries of the city centre.
  • 50 km-per-hour on the main arteries of sectors outside the city centre

CITY OF MONTREAL MULLS OVER REDUCING SPEED LIMITS ACROSS THE ISLAND
SkyTrain-vs-LRT-speeds-300x140@2x.png



However, I don't think the reduced top speed would have as much of an impact on travel times as all the red lights that it needs to stop at.

Elevated sections are not unusual for LRTs. For instance, here is Calgary's "new" (2012) west LRT :
Click to expand...

OMG you are soooo right.. we better cancel finch west and eglinton east as well. Its great to hear from people who have been out of this province to see real transit at work. Virtual high five....
 
sixrings said:
OMG you are soooo right.. we better cancel finch west and eglinton east as well. Its great to hear from people who have been out of this province to see real transit at work. Virtual high five....
Click to expand...

Almost as great as it is to hear from transit enthusiasts engaging in sincere, reasoned debate about the trade-offs between different technology options :)
 
A high top speed is only good if the equipment can make use of it.

The Toronto subway is completely grade separated, and is rated for a maximum of 80km/h. There are maybe 2 locations on the entire system where a train can reach that speed.

Dan
Toronto, Ont.
 
I imagine they will make that speed on the way to STC should the extension ever be built? That could mean a 6 minute trip between STC and Kennedy.
 
innsertnamehere said:
I imagine they will make that speed on the way to STC should the extension ever be built? That could mean a 6 minute trip between STC and Kennedy.
Click to expand...

Doubtful. As powerful as a subway train is it needs a lot more to overcome the drag of running in a confined space, and there aren't likely to be substantial grades to help.

Dan
Toronto, Ont.
 
RyanM12 said:
For that matter, I can't believe east of Don Mills is not grade separated. What a waste. Eglinton could've become the most important transit corridor.
Click to expand...

It does not need to be, there is already a subway and a GO line to Kennedy Station, and the travel time savings would be only a few minutes. It should have been separated at Leslie of course, and it would have been worth while to examine an underpass at Victoria Park, but beyond that it is not worth while.
 
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