Toronto Crosstown LRT | ?m | ?s | Metrolinx | Arcadis

[OneCity]

When highways needs an overpass or underpass at a city street, money is no object.

When a LRT needs an overpass or underpass at a city street, please fill out this 12 volume questionnaire in triplicate, jump through these hoops of fire, and turn your head & cough. Oops, we ran out of money.

This hurts cars drivers just as much. I couldn't even begin to imagine Kingston Rd & Lawrence not receiving grade separation on the Eglinton East LRT

 

[TheTigerMaster]

When highways needs an overpass or underpass at a city street, money is no object.

When a LRT needs an overpass or underpass at a city street, please fill out this 12 volume questionnaire in triplicate, jump through these hoops of fire, and turn your head & cough. Oops, we ran out of money.

This hurts cars drivers just as much. I couldn't even begin to imagine Kingston Rd & Lawrence not receiving grade separation on the Eglinton East LRT

The congestion at Kingston and Lawrence is insane. I was driving there last week during rush hour; it took me around five minutes to get from Galloway to Lawrence (730 metres). And of course we have fairly complex traffic movements in the Lawrence/Morningside/Kingston triangle, which will certainly have negative impacts on LRT operations. In particular, the LRT is going to need a dedicated left phase to turn from Kington onto Morningside. And I recall that the signal phases at Lawrence/Kingston were quite long, which will significantly slow the trains unless some serious optimizations can be done (I doubt it).

We really should grade separate the section of the LRT on Kington northeast of Galloway, and have the LRT turn left onto Morningside on the elevated guideway. Have there been any plans to examine optimization of Crosstown East, as was done with Crosstown West? I haven't heard City Planning talk about optimizations for East at all.

Anyways I was quite surprised to see how busy Kingston/Lawrence is. It was only a few years ago I used to travel through that area several times a week, and I didn't remember it being that bad.

 

[OneCity]

The congestion at Kingston and Lawrence is insane. I was driving there last week during rush hour; it took me around five minutes to get from Galloway to Lawrence (730 metres). And of course we have fairly complex traffic movements in the Lawrence/Morningside/Kingston triangle, which will certainly have negative impacts on LRT operations. In particular, the LRT is going to need a dedicated left phase to turn from Kington onto Morningside. And I recall that the signal phases at Lawrence/Kingston were quite long, which will significantly slow the trains unless some serious optimizations can be done (I doubt it).

We really should grade separate the section of the LRT on Kington northeast of Galloway, and have the LRT turn left onto Morningside on the elevated guideway. Have there been any plans to examine optimization of Crosstown East, as was done with Crosstown West? I haven't heard City Planning talk about optimizations for East at all.

Anyways I was quite surprised to see how busy Kingston/Lawrence is. It was only a few years ago I used to travel through that area several times a week, and I didn't remember it being that bad.

Durham is barely scratching the surface of its growth which is set to accelerate over the next decade and on. I cant even imagine.

 

[WislaHD]

This hurts cars drivers just as much. I couldn't even begin to imagine Kingston Rd & Lawrence not receiving grade separation on the Eglinton East LRT

Elevated would solve all our problems on the east end.

 

[robmausser]

View attachment 127276

This is what should be actually built, with grade separation.

Save money by removing the mid blocks.

Also, I am sure the stations for the grade separation could be built cheaper, they look insanely overbuilt for no reason.

 

[Hopkins123]

The congestion at Kingston and Lawrence is insane. I was driving there last week during rush hour; it took me around five minutes to get from Galloway to Lawrence (730 metres). And of course we have fairly complex traffic movements in the Lawrence/Morningside/Kingston triangle, which will certainly have negative impacts on LRT operations. In particular, the LRT is going to need a dedicated left phase to turn from Kington onto Morningside. And I recall that the signal phases at Lawrence/Kingston were quite long, which will significantly slow the trains unless some serious optimizations can be done (I doubt it).

We really should grade separate the section of the LRT on Kington northeast of Galloway, and have the LRT turn left onto Morningside on the elevated guideway. Have there been any plans to examine optimization of Crosstown East, as was done with Crosstown West? I haven't heard City Planning talk about optimizations for East at all.

Anyways I was quite surprised to see how busy Kingston/Lawrence is. It was only a few years ago I used to travel through that area several times a week, and I didn't remember it being that bad.

I've long stated in this thread that the Crosstown East LRT should have grade separation at the major intersections, particularly at the West Hill triangle. You kind of get the sense that the planners don't actually have to deal with traffic conditions in the areas they're prescribing at grade level, road median solutions too; the same way as you or I would.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

Those reports looks like a crazy exercise in conflict avoidance.

AoD

 

[W. K. Lis]

When SmartTrack was to be heavy rail along Eglinton West, it would not have been at grade, but grade separated. Along the entire length.

It was changed from heavy rail to light rail. However, parts of the corridor (IE. Martin Grove) should be grade separated. It would still be cheaper than SmartTrack heavy rail option.

 

[M II A II R II K]

On the east side they should combine a VP and Pharmacy stop and have it underground and call it Eglinton Square.

 

[robmausser]

When SmartTrack was to be heavy rail along Eglinton West, it would not have been at grade, but grade separated. Along the entire length.

It was changed from heavy rail to light rail. However, parts of the corridor (IE. Martin Grove) should be grade separated. It would still be cheaper than SmartTrack heavy rail option.

Absolutely. The reversal to LRT was supposed to be a compromise between a heavy rail option and the original LRT plan.

 

[WislaHD]

Aren't we also getting to that point where grade separation is becoming so expensive that it might probably just be cheaper to expropriate the townhomes on Widdicombe?

 

[Hopkins123]

This is what should be actually built, with grade separation.

Save money by removing the mid blocks.

Also, I am sure the stations for the grade separation could be built cheaper, they look insanely overbuilt for no reason.

It's not only what's needed, it's what would have been built from the 80s or 90s had we not changed governments. We're over 20 years behind just playing catch up.

Hard to believe $800 million is all that stands between us getting the ideal solution or receiving the worst proposal imaginable that'll be slower than the existing 32 bus. I thought SmartTrack was earmarked to receive up to $8 billion, a sizable chuck for a fully grade-separated line across Eglinton? There should be more than enough funds available to go with the grade-separated options.

 

[sixrings]

How can a lrt in its own row be slower than the existing bus? What makes you think this or where is the stats to show this?

 

[Hopkins123]

On the east side they should combine a VP and Pharmacy stop and have it underground and call it Eglinton Square.

The VP stop should definitely be situated in the Eglinton Square triangle, but I would rather see them combine the Pharmacy and Lebovic stops into one trenched or elevated station in the mid block.

 

[Hopkins123]

How can a lrt in its own row be slower than the existing bus? What makes you think this or where is the stats to show this?

Buses can clear changing traffic signals faster from what I've observed. The 510 in its own ROW is notoriously slow. Just the other day, it took me 25 minutes just to get from King and Spadina to Spadina Stn on the 510. By comparison, the University Line would have taken less than 10 from St Andrew to Spadina. Buses like the 63 also do the Bloor to Queen trip relatively quick.

With road median at-grade tracks, in general I find that there's just too much that could go wrong. Not saying that solutions can't be found but no sense calling something "rapid transit" if it underperforms constantly.