CIBC SQUARE | 241.39m | 50s | Hines | WilkinsonEyre

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V of E

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BA had the density for a 1,500ft tower. Brookfield choose a three building configeration instead probably not wanting to risk trying to lease out so much space at one time.

We can argue the merits of one large tower verses three smaller ones until the cows come home but the fact is the density was there to build the tallest tower in North America outside of Freedom Tower and possibly Sears Tower.

Indeed I can't see any way a 1,500+ ft tower could have been prevented by the city given that Trump was given permission to build a 1,066 ft tower on a postage size lot directly across the street. The OMB. if it had gone that route, would most certainly have approved it.
 
M

mark simpson

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^^cute - somewhat stating the obvious and, yet, not at all relevant to BA

The OMB, which actually rarely sides against the city, is highly unlikely to overturn a very specific shadowing bylaw. Density isn't really an issue and Trump's 1066 foot tall stature, which has a higher cap height to be begin with, is aided by a long pole

dare I say - stick to what you know - spreading those juicy, unsustantiated rumours commercial real estate 'insiders' love to invent
 
V

V of E

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Well that certainly was a most uncalled for response given the subject matter at hand. Fortunately this being the holiday season, and also not wanting to upset my own sensibilities, I will refrain from using profanity in my reply to your childish posting, although "long pole" does have endless possibilities.

P.S. I am "NOT" a real estate insider, whatever that term really means. However I am, through a prior business, very well connected to a number of major architectural and development firms as well as many prominent individual architects on a world wide basis.

So please "Grow Up" Mark and lets move on.
 
M

MrOttawa

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"dare I say - stick to what you know - spreading those juicy, unsustantiated rumours commercial real estate 'insiders' love to invent"

Mark,

I am not being facetious but what is your knowledge? How can we tell with yours and all our identities being anonymous? Would you uncloak yourself to prove your knowledge? I won't.
 
T

The Burgher of TO

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You don't need to know someone's 'identity' in order to know the validity of their information. I'd trust Mark's posts because they're frequently backed up by planning documents that he's been able to show us, and when they're not backed up they almost always turn out to be accurate.

I've been a little more doubtful of V of E's posts because they often have a supercilious air to them, which makes me think he's posting more to prove something or to validate himself rather than to spread information.
 
M

MrOttawa

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Burg,

I agree but he is getting a little huffy. My comments don't calm things down either. I retract what I said.
 

MartinMtl

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There is a report in today's La Presse about a project on 45 Bay Street. The Caisse de Dépots et Placements and Montreal's SITQ bought the land and plan to build a 50 storey tower with one million square foot of office space. Here is the article (sorry, no link, because I copied the article through a wire service that do not permit linking and requires a password to access, but it is published in today's paper. And obviously, it's in french).

La Presse
La Presse Affaires, vendredi 14 septembre 2007, p. LA PRESSE AFFAIRES1

La Caisse construira sur Bay Street



Toronto - C'est au centre-ville de Toronto, sur Bay Street même, que la Caisse de dépôt et placement du Québec prépare l'un de ses plus gros projets immobiliers des dernières années, par l'entremise de sa filiale SITQ.

Il s'agit d'une tour de bureaux qui s'élèverait sur 45 ou 50 étages, avec un peu plus d'un million de pieds carrés en location, a appris La Presse Affaires.

La SITQ est déjà très présente au centre-ville de Montréal. Elle détient aussi des investissements significatifs à Vancouver et à Calgary, notamment.

Mais à Toronto, l'immeuble projeté au "45, Bay Street" constituerait de loin le plus gros investissement de la SITQ dans la capitale financière du Canada.

Elle n'y possède encore que de petits immeubles de bureaux, au centre-ville et en banlieue.

"Nous avons acheté ce lot au 45, Bay Street dans le but d'y construire un immeuble de bureaux qui sera notre point d'entrée fort sur le marché du centre-ville de Toronto", a confirmé Amélie Plante, porte-parole de SITQ à son siège social de Montréal.

Elle a refusé de divulguer le coût de ce terrain de 100 180 pieds carrés, dont l'achat remonte en mai dernier.

Mais de l'avis de courtiers torontois en immobilier commercial, cet emplacement "a dû coûter pas mal cher" parce qu'il s'agit du dernier encore libre pour construction dans la rue Bay, où s'alignent les adresses les plus prestigieuses du quartier financier de Toronto.

De plus, le lot est situé à deux pas de la gare Union, important carrefour de transports en commun, et un voisin immédiat des deux principales artères routières du centre-ville.

Aussi, le "45, Bay Street" est situé en face du Centre Air Canada, l'amphithéâtre des Maple Leafs de la LNH et des Raptors de la NBA, ainsi qu'un important lieu de divertissement des professionnels fortunés du quartier financier.

Quant au coût de l'immeuble projeté et son échéancier de construction, on indique à la SITQ qu'il faudrait encore "quelques mois" avant de préciser ces informations.

À partir des coûts des autres tours de bureaux en chantier au centre-ville de Toronto, on peut estimer le coût total d'un immeuble d'une quarantaine d'étages et d'un million de pieds carrés à quelque 200 millions de dollars.

D'ailleurs, comme elle le fait ailleurs qu'à Montréal, la SITQ souhaite s'associer des partenaires torontois pour la gestion du futur immeuble. Mais elle prévoit en demeurer seule propriétaire, à moins d'offre intéressante.

Beaucoup de pieds carrés

Quant à la conjoncture de marché, des courtiers torontois estiment que la SITQ devra bien analyser l'échéancier de commercialisation et de construction de son projet. Car il surviendrait à la suite de trois gros immeubles de bureaux déjà en chantier au centre-ville, qui ajouteront environ 3,5 millions de pieds carrés en location d'ici deux ans.

Pour le moment, le taux d'inoccupation des immeubles de première catégorie -un indice-clé pour les promoteurs- s'établit autour de 5,5% dans le quartier financier de Toronto.

"Après des années sans construction majeure, et la hausse de la demande de locaux, c'est un marché favorable aux promoteurs immobiliers et aux locateurs d'immeubles existants", selon Raymond Wong, analyste de marché chez CB Richard Ellis, important courtier torontois en locaux de bureaux.

Mais avec les trois gros immeubles déjà en chantier, M. Wong s'attend à ce que ce taux d'inoccupation remonte autour de 12% au moment de leur livraison simultanée, à la fin de 2009.

"Malgré tout, ça devrait encore être un marché intéressant pour les promoteurs, pour autant que l'économie ne ralentisse pas trop d'ici là", selon M. Wong.

Chez la SITQ, la porte-parole, Amélie Plante, a indiqué que "les perspectives de marché au centre-ville de Toronto font évidemment partie de l'analyse détaillée du projet".
 

taal

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Can someone please translate - at least the importent stuff :)
 

299 bloor call control.

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via Google Translate... obviously imperfect:

Toronto - It is with the downtown area of Toronto, on Bay Street
even, that the Case of deposit and placement of Quebec
prepare one of its larger real projects of
last years, via its subsidiary company SITQ.

It is about a tower of offices which would rise on 45 or 50
stages, with a little more than one million square feet in
hiring, learned the Press Businesses.

The SITQ is already very present at the downtown area of Montreal.
It holds also significant investments with
Vancouver and in Calgary, in particular.

But in Toronto, the building projected to the “45, Bay Street”
the largest investment would constitute by far of
SITQ in the financial capital of Canada.

It has yet only small buildings there of
offices, with the downtown area and in suburbs.

“We bought this batch to the 45, Bay Street with an aim of y
to build an office building which will be our point
of entry strong on the market of the downtown area of Toronto ", has
confirmed Amélie Plants, spokesman of SITQ to his seat
social of Montreal.

It refused to reveal the cost of this ground of 100 180
square feet, whose purchase goes up last May.

But of the opinion of Toronto-native brokers in real estate
commercial, this site “had to be not badly expensive”
because it is about the still free last for construction
in the street Bay, where the addresses are aligned more
prestigious of the financial district of Toronto.

Moreover, the batch is located at two steps of the Union station,
important crossroads of public transport, and one
immediate neighbor of the two principal road arteries of
downtown area.

Also, the “45, Bay Street” is located opposite the Center Air
Canada, the amphitheatre of Maple Leafs of the LNH and of
Raptors of the NBA, as well as an important place of
entertainment of the fortunate professionals of the district
financier.

As for the cost of the projected building and its bill book of
construction, one indicates to the SITQ that it would still be necessary
“a few months” before specifying this information.

Starting from the costs of the others turns of offices in building site
with the downtown area of Toronto, one can consider the cost total
of a building of forty stages and a million
square feet to some 200 million dollars.

Moreover, like it does it elsewhere than in Montreal,
SITQ wishes to join Toronto-native partners for
management of the future building. But it envisages to remain about it
sole owner, with less interesting offer.

Many square feet

As for the economic situation of market, Toronto-native brokers
estimate that the SITQ will have to analyze the bill book well of
marketing and of construction of its project. Because it
would occur following three large buildings of
offices already in building site with the downtown area, which will add
approximately 3,5 million square feet in hiring from here two
years.

For the moment, the rate of inoccupation of the buildings of
first category - a index-key for the promoters
is established around 5,5% in the financial district of
Toronto.

“After years without major construction, and raises it
request for buildings, it is a market favorable to
property developers and with the lessors of buildings
existing ", according to Raymond Wong, analyst of market at
CB Richard Ellis, important Toronto-native broker locally of
offices.

But with the three large buildings already in building site, Mr.
Wong expects that this rate of inoccupation goes up
around 12% at the time of their simultaneous delivery, with
end of 2009.

“Despite everything, that should still be an interesting market
for the promoters, in so far as economy
does not slow down too much by then ", according to Mr. Wong.

At the SITQ, the spokesman, Amélie Plant, indicated
that “prospects for market to the downtown area of
Toronto form obviously part of the detailed analysis of
project ".
 

Fad225

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Le Caisse de Dépots et Placements and Montreal's SITQ, qu'ils font exactement?
 

unimaginative2

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The Caisse is the Quebec government's pension fund management organization, the largest in Canada, and SITQ is their office real estate arm.

To summarize:
They're looking for an entry into the Toronto office market. They bought this expensive property last May, considered to be the last large lot on prestigious Bay St. It's also across from the ACC, a popular hangout for financial industry types.
40-odd floors, 1 million square feet, approximately $200 million cost of construction.

I worked across the street from their gorgeous headquarters in Montreal. If this building shows anything like the same architectural distinction, we're in for a real treat.
 

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