Toronto/Boston comparisons

[Ladies Mile]

Why not?

If we're going to do this nonsense, we might as well choose a city with a somewhat similar urban fabric.

 

[taal]

I really urge any moderator to delete this thread ... no offense Ladies Mile.

The best part is, no matter what city you pick, I have a good feeling you'll get the exact same argument and subsequent responses on both side.
This includes comparisons to small rust belt towns ...

 

[Red October]

In what universe is Boston similar to Toronto? It has more in common with Halifax.

I might as well make a thread about Toronto/Honolulu comparisons.

 

[Ladies Mile]

Compact downtown, but multiple "clusters" of tall buildings and satellite centers; main shopping arteries in small-scale buildings often converted from domestic use; quiet, leafy neighborhoods directly adjacent to or within blocks of major avenues; schools and universities as a fundamental part of the urban core and its fabric overall; an initial impression of suburban sobriety and quiet conservatism that yields distinctly subversive elements upon closer inspection; a much-used and iconic subway system that frankly could use a bit of work; a notion of somehow being "British" or European" in flavor compared with most other American cities, yet is actually fairly unique.

For starters.

 

[Ladies Mile]

In what universe is Boston similar to Toronto? It has more in common with Halifax.

I might as well make a thread about Toronto/Honolulu comparisons.

As Honolulu is the most ethnically diverse city in the entire US, such a comparison might not be entirely without merit.

 

[kkgg7]

In what universe is Boston similar to Toronto? It has more in common with Halifax.

I might as well make a thread about Toronto/Honolulu comparisons.

I think it does make sense. The two cities are actually of similar size (metro Boston has 4.5M people) and as Ladies Mile points out share many common things.

Stop kidding yourself into thinking Toronto is some sort of Canadian version of NYC/Chicago. It has proven to be unrealistic in most aspects and usually ends up in weak arguments such as "look at how much pedestrian traffic on our streets!" or "highest foreign-born residents" etc.

Halifax, who the hell has heard about Halifax, NS outside Canada? Ask any Japanese, Chinese, Europeans or even Americans outside New England and I am sure less than 2% ever heard of this city.

In reality, I always think Toronto is more similar to Philadelphia, a city most Torontonians somehow seem to think not good enough for comparison but actually is the closest thing to Toronto.

 

[Ladies Mile]

Philadelphia would be an interesting point of comparison.

Other cities that strike me as providing clear points of comparison (although none are exactly alike) are Columbus, OH; Denver; Portland, OR; and Los Angeles, with which we share a great deal, a large amount of it positive.

 

[OttoSchloss]

I think Portland ME and Halifax are comparative cities. Boston actually reminds me of Montreal, they both have a compactness and an inward exclusiveness or provincialism that gives them their easily definable character. Although Montreal exudes charm where Boston does not. Los Angeles and Toronto are a pretty apt comparison and while I'm not a particular fan of Los Angeles I can always understand why people would want to live there and as much as I love San Francisco -L.A. is probably the better city.

 

[UserNameToronto]

I think Portland ME and Halifax are comparative cities. Boston actually reminds me of Montreal, they both have a compactness and an inward exclusiveness or provincialism that gives them their easily definable character. Although Montreal exudes charm where Boston does not. Los Angeles and Toronto are a pretty apt comparison and while I'm not a particular fan of Los Angeles I can always understand why people would want to live there and as much as I love San Francisco -L.A. is probably the better city.

Top 5 US cities (by city proper population):
NYC / 8.2M
LA / 3.8M
Chicago / 2.7M
Houston / 2.1M
Philadelphia / 1.5M
Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_cities_by_population

Toronto / 2.6M (would be #4 on the list above)

Cities mentioned in this thread that people somehow think are comparable:
Hololulu / 0.4M
Boston / 0.6M
Portland / 0.6M
Denver / 0.6M
Columbus / 0.8M
Halifax / 0.4M (including the entire surrounding county area)

These "comparable" cities are not even close. Why do people insist on selling Toronto short? We should be comparing ourselves with other big deal, same size cities. Toronto would indeed be a lot like Halifax or Portland if it was small and tiny. But it isn't.

There's an undercurrent of self-deprication in Toronto that ignores its size, wealth, and global importance.

 

[vicente]

Other cities that strike me as providing clear points of comparison (although none are exactly alike) are Columbus, OH

Columbus and Toronto are like night and day. Columbus has virtually no public transit, its downtown is deserted, its university is located too far away from downtown to walk there, it is highly racially segregated between black and white, and is not on a large body of water (unless you count the mighty Scioto and Olentangy rivers), and is in a state not dominated by a single city (Cleveland, Cincinnati, Dayton, Toledo, etc.).

 

[Ladies Mile]

Top 5 US cities (by city proper population):
NYC / 8.2M
LA / 3.8M
Chicago / 2.7M
Houston / 2.1M
Philadelphia / 1.5M
Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_cities_by_population

Toronto / 2.6M (would be #4 on the list above)

Cities mentioned in this thread that people somehow think are comparable:
Hololulu / 0.4M
Boston / 0.6M
Portland / 0.6M
Denver / 0.6M
Columbus / 0.8M
Halifax / 0.4M (including the entire surrounding county area)

These "comparable" cities are not even close. Why do people insist on selling Toronto short? We should be comparing ourselves with other big deal, same size cities. Toronto would indeed be a lot like Halifax or Portland if it was small and tiny. But it isn't.

There's an undercurrent of self-deprication in Toronto that ignores its size, wealth, and global importance.

As we do, indeed, appear to ignore those very things, it should not be surprising that in terms of public realm and general perception, we are closer to smaller cities.

I am always fascinated by arguments that appear to suppose that things must be of the same size to be compared at all. In which case, I suppose our American cousins are correct to ignore pretty much everything we do as we are so much less populated than they are. "Nothing to see up north, folks! They're not the same size!"

 

[Ladies Mile]

Columbus and Toronto are like night and day. Columbus has virtually no public transit, its downtown is deserted, its university is located too far away from downtown to walk there, it is highly racially segregated between black and white, and is not on a large body of water (unless you count the mighty Scioto and Olentangy rivers), and is in a state not dominated by a single city (Cleveland, Cincinnati, Dayton, Toledo, etc.).

On the other hand both have very large gay populations, are the seats of government, Columbus is one of the very few cities to have preserved freestanding domestic stock directly adjacent to downtown (think Cabbagetown) and both fly under the radar in terms of public perception.

 

[OttoSchloss]

Toronto may not be everyone's cup o' tea but it certainly does not fly under the radar.

 

[nfitz]

Back to the topic of the thread.

Boston has 2 O's and only 1 T, while Toronto has 3 O's and 2 T's, clearly making it superior.

 

[EMP1729]

But Boston has 5 different letters, compared to Toronto's 4. Therefore Boston is superior.