Toronto Bike Share

[PL1]

I could see the ebike getting some traction if they reach wide deployment. It's much cheaper than an uber ride.

As a longtime member with the annual 45 plan, I won't be grabbing ebikes often with this fare structure. My ~25 min ride to work would be an additional $2.50. I can hoof it on the regular bikes for no charge in about 30 min. Or TTC for $3.20 (or whatever it's changing to).

Maybe I'll change my mind after a while, but I'm rather nonplussed at the moment.

 

[afransen]

As a longtime member with the annual 45 plan, I won't be grabbing ebikes often with this fare structure. My ~25 min ride to work would be an additional $2.50. I can hoof it on the regular bikes for no charge in about 30 min. Or TTC for $3.20 (or whatever it's changing to).

Maybe I'll change my mind after a while, but I'm rather nonplussed at the moment.

Ebikes are kind of an easter egg at the moment. If they are widely and consistently available, Bikeshare might become more attractive to a larger userbase. I suspect you'd still have the problem of people only using them to ride up hill. It won't tale long at $3 a ride to recoup the additional cost of the ebike.

 

[generalcanada]

Overall, I disagree with the changes.

I think a price for the casual user that equates to $4.60 for a single 30 minute ride will discourage 'sampling' of the service and reduce overall uptake. $4 per 30 minute overage for the first minute of overage is also excessive.

Per minute pricing for E-Bikes is needlessly convoluted; a simple unlock (or base fee) difference would be better.

I also disagree with having a low-income pass; as I've discussed in many other contexts, most low-income people will never get one; you have to apply, you have to prove your low income, for many that's challenging bureaucracy and hassle; if they even know about it; and for others its an assault on their dignity; all while driving up complexity.

Take that sum of money and find an easier way to create affordable value.

For example, have a Presto Card; you can add a Bikeshare membership onto the card for only $100 for 30M/ and $110 for 45M. Alternatively, simply provide 45M with the $105 membership. Both would increase the value proposition. Integrate functionality with Presto either way; eliminating the need for an app or a fob or whatever other silly non-sense may apply.

This seems like its designed to deter membership growth.

The overage cost has always been 4$ per 30 min.
agreed with the presto
i think the uses for the $0.12 per minute are very different than a 3.25 per ride
thats 18.75 minutes to equal the original 3.25 charge

TBH thats actually better especially when most trips are very short distance

 

[ShonTron]

I like the premium for e-bikes, as long as it helps fund charging stations and a larger fleet of them. It will discourage the food couriers hogging the few e-bikes somewhat; a steeper overage cost would be better.

 

[nfitz]

As someone who's never used a bike-share, but keeps thinking I should at some point (as I don't own a bicycle, and live a block away from a station) - I don't find that (8?-part) fare description comprehensible - or encouraging.

 

[innsertnamehere]

honestly this new fare structure is closer to how most other major bike share companies operate in the US, from my experience. Toronto has always been odd having single-fares be a flat fee.

 

[innsertnamehere]

As someone who's never used a bike-share, but keeps thinking I should at some point (as I don't own a bicycle, and live a block away from a station) - I don't find that (8?-part) fare description comprehensible - or encouraging.

If you aren't a member, it;s not that complicated:
regular bike: $1+12c/minute
e-bike: $1+20c/minute

 

[Northern Light]

honestly this new fare structure is closer to how most other major bike share companies operate in the US, from my experience. Toronto has always been odd having single-fares be a flat fee.

Its also been more successful than most U.S. counterparts. I think that's important to say as well.

 

[innsertnamehere]

Its also been more successful than most U.S. counterparts. I think that's important to say as well.

perhaps.

Hamilton, just an hour down the QEW, operates on a per-minute structure and always has, with significantly more expensive full membership fees.

Hamilton Bike Share

Bike the Hammer!

hamilton.socialbicycles.com

$0.15/minute, no membership
$20/month - 90 minutes free every day
$100 every 6 months - 90 minutes free every day

Hamilton manages to more or less break even with this model and it does so as the smallest city in North America to operate a bike-share network. The system is considerably more worn than Toronto's though, and shows that it's run on a non-profit basis.

 

[nfitz]

If you aren't a member, it;s not that complicated:
regular bike: $1+12c/minute
e-bike: $1+20c/minute

Perhaps not - but I'm overwhelmed by the options.

I can't even see where to stick the coins! Though perhaps it would be a good way to get rid of my pennies. Is it like the phone booth, where it beeps at you, when you have to put in more coins?

 

[JacindaArdern]

Integrate functionality with Presto either way; eliminating the need for an app or a fob or whatever other silly non-sense may apply.

The app is essential to the whole concept. You need it to see where the stations are, if there are any empty docks / if there are any available bikes in a given station. The need for an app will never be eliminated.

As for the fee structure, without looking at stats I assume a huge majority of users have annual pass. So not much change there. I could never get my hands on the e-bikes anyway, so the per minute charge on them is inconsequential to me **shrug**

As someone who's never used a bike-share, but keeps thinking I should at some point (as I don't own a bicycle, and live a block away from a station) - I don't find that (8?-part) fare description comprehensible - or encouraging.

I disagree here. Maybe they can do away the 30-minute annual membership now but that's about it.

This is all there is:
i) Annual membership costs this much (flat fee, unlimited rides)
ii) you cannot hang onto a bike forever so there is an overage fee
iii) e-bikes are rare so they cost extra
iv) there are other options if you don't want an annual membership

There's also a subsidy that probably doesn't apply to you. I don't see how any of this is extra complicated. To make it easier for you, an annual membership is the logical choice 99% of the time if you live close to a station.

 

[daptive]

The app is essential to the whole concept. You need it to see where the stations are, if there are any empty docks / if there are any available bikes in a given station. The need for an app will never be eliminated.

As for the fee structure, without looking at stats I assume a huge majority of users have annual pass. So not much change there. I could never get my hands on the e-bikes anyway, so the per minute charge on them is inconsequential to me **shrug**



I disagree here. Maybe they can do away the 30-minute annual membership now but that's about it.

This is all there is:
i) Annual membership costs this much (flat fee, unlimited rides)
ii) you cannot hang onto a bike forever so there is an overage fee
iii) e-bikes are rare so they cost extra
iv) there are other options if you don't want an annual membership

There's also a subsidy that probably doesn't apply to you. I don't see how any of this is extra complicated. To make it easier for you, an annual membership is the logical choice 99% of the time if you live close to a station.

Fully agree with your analysis here. Definitely don't get rid of the app; I don't think removing ways people can rent bikes is the right direction, integrating with Presto would be interesting though, especially if I can add Presto to my phone/watch.

My gut reaction was negative regarding the additional cost for e-bikes but it's a solution to bike hoarding and looking back it was odd/a treat that we ever got them at the same price as regular bikes. I personally won't be renting them out anymore, even if I find one, but I'll happily still pay for the annual membership.

 

[generalcanada]

Food delivery riders hogging e-bikes is one reason Toronto wants to raise Bike Share fees

The new fees are an attempt to stop food delivery employees from “monopolizing” the bike share program’s e-bikes.

www.thestar.com

err they just said it out loud....WTF

Food delivery riders fear fees​

Delivery riders, however, fear the proposed new charge, which could start April 3, would “create devastating impacts for precarious workers who deliver by e-bike,” said Jennifer Scott, a courier and president of Gig Workers United.

Also this is actually a good idea:

An amendment from Coun. Chris Moise changed the proposed block $4 overage charge for half an hour to a 12 cents per minute charge that would help keep rider costs down.

Is there a need for the 30 minute minimum overage if you dont hit the time limit?

 

[elcorrerador]

err they just said it out loud....WTF

What's wrong with saying that out loud?
I'm gonna assume that they have the data to back that up.

 

[generalcanada]

What's wrong with saying that out loud?
I'm gonna assume that they have the data to back that up.

I'm just surprised they people representing the delivery people admit that the ebikes are being hogged by them and ruining the system for everyone else.