urbanboyto
Active Member
saw these from the Gardiner on the weekend. They have quite a dramatic presence on entering the city and at least they are not more boxes.
Toronto Beyond The Sea | ?m | 44s | Empire | Richmond Architects
scrapergeek
Active Member
I'm a big fan of this project. It's disappointing that as soon as something imaginative is built in the GTA it gets lambasted by the usual suspects... the "materials snobs" and the "box lovers". These buildings have an amazing presence, which will further be enhanced by the third tower. Totally appropriate for the location. Also they make interesting "sentinels" to the city as you drive in.
Sure we'd all like to see top grade materials on every building, but you have to be realistic to the costs and logistics of these projects. Anyways, I'm sure I'm just repeating myself.
I'm guessing you'll see these completed towers being photographed regularly by the casual observer, due to the impact they have.
Sure we'd all like to see top grade materials on every building, but you have to be realistic to the costs and logistics of these projects. Anyways, I'm sure I'm just repeating myself.
I'm guessing you'll see these completed towers being photographed regularly by the casual observer, due to the impact they have.
Torontovibe
Senior Member
And how much more expensive would have it been to just cover the roof in a decent material? I can't see the price going up an unreasonable amount.
Is it too much to ask that developers put a bit more though and effort into building their buildings? After-all, we all have to live with it for years to come. The built form has an effect on all of us, whether we like to acknowledge it or not.
Is it too much to ask that developers put a bit more though and effort into building their buildings? After-all, we all have to live with it for years to come. The built form has an effect on all of us, whether we like to acknowledge it or not.
junctionist
Senior Member
People have every right to be disappointed with easily-avoidable flaws in a project and disappointment should be directed at the people who make these things happen. The people noticing these details aren't snobs; they're ordinary people who pick up on visible details. Even people who aren't on UT and don't follow the world of design and construction do subconsciously notice these details and make judgments based on them, except they don't say "I'm disappointed with the materials"; they say "this tower is gimmicky", "this tower is nothing special", or "this tower is cheap and boring" if they're that polite.
The critiques are especially important when "something imaginative" is built because those buildings command the most attention and become the most prominent. The standards become higher. Not every project will see the finest materials because of price points but for any project at any price point there's a clean way of designing and building and a sloppy way of doing so. Creativity in design and execution is always possible. One may expect creativity, polish, and sophistication in every major project of this magnitude, along with clean execution of the design with attention to detail. After all, these buildings will be seen by tens of thousands of people and will be around for many generations.
vegeta_skyline
Senior Member
This debate is not without merit but I think you are far exaggerating the impact such a design choice will have on the average person. I'm not excusing developers for cheapening out on a project, for there are those of us that are concerned about such matters. However, while ultimately the quality of the finishes may not be great, neither will be the effect on the majority of those "tens of thousands of people" you speak of. Lets be honest here, the only ones who will be seriously effected by any such a design choice - which in no way effects how a building meets the street and that is only noticeable from some distance away, will be skyscraper aficionados like us. To the average passerby on the highway they might take note of the tops of these building but once they have discerned that it is of no interest to them they are unlikely to pay much future attention to them and thus the quality of their lives will in no way be diminished.
Torontovibe
Senior Member
^^^ I disagree with you. Sure people might drive by and not even notice things but it still effects them even if they don't realize it. Many studies have shown that people are effected by many things like colour and light. I think a well designed city has a great effect on people's moods and even their over-all mental health. I know when I'm in a beautiful neighbourhood, I feel much better than when I'm walking or driving through an isolated, badly designed area. You may not realize it but design does have a huge effect on people. That's why animating streets is so important.
vegeta_skyline
Senior Member
Sure light and color can effect a person subconsciously but I think what your speaking of is more about whats on the ground level - places where buildings and people come together. I don't see how the choice of an aluminum panel 300ft in the air will have any such pronounced effect. Are people in Winnipeg or Edmonton more depressed on average than those in Toronto or Vancouver because the majority of their taller buildings are more commonly clad with concrete rather than glass?
junctionist
Senior Member
Most people do pick up on these things. Many have seen so much mediocrity as to have developed a deep-rooted cynicism or indifference. Yet that interest exists, it's just ignored. But it can be noted any time with declarations of the ugliness of a particular building, sometimes clumsily in regards to a building that doesn't have any great faults.
Some take an extreme position of not caring at all by philosophy, but such a position is rare. One stereotype of engineers is that they fall into this category. On the other end of the spectrum, aficionados tend to engage with these issues with more passion, knowledge, and precision. The aficionado may identify the issues with the materials and converse about, but the others still react with an overall "meh". It's casual conversation. How can you not? Toronto is a major city; the built form is our reality. The person who doesn't care today may notice tomorrow.
I'm not so sure about depression, but I know that most people pick up on design to varying extents. It tends not to be ignored if it's a prominent building.
scar007
New Member
can we get back on track here?
this thread has become useless. the last 2-3 pages have been about sails on the roof and people's philosophies on design and architecture.
this thread has become useless. the last 2-3 pages have been about sails on the roof and people's philosophies on design and architecture.
vegeta_skyline
Senior Member
Can you please leave?
As its clear that you do not contribute anything constructive to the forum.
UT is all about discussions related to design and architecture. If that doesn't interest you, than just what are you doing here?
Automation Gallery
Superstar
I kind of like the roof sails on these 3 buildings, and when all is said and done with the Lagos, Westlakes, and other dozen or more 40/50+ storey buildings to be built in the near vicinity...wont even be noticeable. Whats all the fuss
vegeta_skyline
Senior Member
I kind of like the roof sails on these 3 buildings, and when all is said and done with the Lagos, Westlakes, and other dozen or more 40/50+ storey buildings to be built in the near vicinity...wont even be noticeable. Whats all the fuss
Beats me, I like these buildings overall and despite the materials used on the sails these buildings are better with that design feature than without it. Apparently for some people they resemble KKK hoods
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UrbanAffair
Senior Member
vegeta_skyline
Senior Member
Nautilus is looking taller than Palace Place & Palace Pier.
cruzin4u
Senior Member
[Taken 01-07/2011]
