Toronto Bathurst Quay Revitalization | ?m | 2s | City of Toronto | Kearns Mancini

Torontovibe said:
"Does every place have to be an attraction?"

Are you serious? We have more than enough underused, passive parkland on our waterfront, with more on the way. What we really need is FUN!
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Not sure how often you're hanging out in these supposedly passive parks, but I think you need to come down to the waterfront more often. It's brutally packed in the summer and navigating the crowds do to your weekend errands is tough (though I love the vibrancy). As an example of park use, I've never even had a chance to sit on the beach in one of the nice muskoka chairs at HTO Park on a weekend because it's too busy. Oh and what's so passive about the Queens Quay revitalization that will be creating a massive new public space throughout the central waterfront?
It's well known that for a city our size, Toronto has very few tourist areas and attractions? Ask any Torontonian if they think Toronto has enough good tourist attractions? Everyone I have talked to has said NO!
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Simply because people are ignorant doesn't mean they're correct. As someone who has worked in tourism development at the city and provincial level, I could easily create a week long itinerary for any visitor that will keep them busy. I started to list everything and then I thought, no, these are way too obvious and no one can be that dumb to overlook them.

I think the question should be can we start taking tourism seriously and start building a few great tourist areas. (and attractions)
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I agree that we should take tourism seriously, but we have many great tourist attractions and "areas" (as if we even want tourist areas). Oh and hey, we're building an aquarium and finding ways to revitalize Ontario Place. Or do those not count?
We have the whole Central Waterfront and almost none of it has any serious attractions except for Harbourfront. The area east of Yonge will not have one single tourist attraction or cultural venue. (no art galleries, no museums, no cultural centres) It will be just parks and condos, with a few office buildings thrown in for good measure. We have a huge waterfront and almost no major attractions on it, not to mention, an iconic building. Shouldn't a great waterfront have at least one iconic building on it? (or is that too much to ask from a "world class city"?) I think Toronto needs a lot more major attractions (especially on the waterfront) and tourist areas, not just for tourists but for Torontonians, like myself.
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Apart from Chicago, I can't really think of another waterfront city with a waterfront that will blow your mind with non-stop elite attractions and public space. And actually, if you want to be technical, the CN Tower is as close to the waterfront as the Art Institute of Chicago and the Bean. The only difference is they've built a large park between those sites and the lake and we've chosen to build a community. Neither is wrong. The other thing is, we've chosen not to centralize our attractions. If you visit Chicago you have little reason to venture beyond the central waterfront, whereas here you have to travel throughout the city to see the traditional attractions, which also means that people have to explore our communities and neighbourhoods, which I think many people would say is a strong suit for Toronto.

To me, we don't need anymore huge attractions. At best, I'd suggest we just need a City of Toronto Museum, but I'd put that in Old City Hall, and no where near the waterfront.
Not all Torontonians are a stick in the mud.
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But some are pretty ignorant.

Torontovibe said:
Would condo owners want to live right beside an airport? Well, if they want to live right beside the Gardener, with all it's noise and pollution, I guess anything is possible but I think a mid priced hotel might be a better option, as long as it is tied in with a tourist type area like South Street Seaport. An area of waterfront retail, attractions and shopping might work.
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Actually, I'm sitting in my condo that is sandwiched between QQ and the Gardiner and I can't hear the highway at all (I did just hear two streetcars rumble by though). But thanks for perpetuating myths.
 
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Good post jn

I hadn't seen the edit with the stick in the mud comment. I guess Torontovibe, you've never heard of "different strokes"? Some people want non-stop fun, some prefer quiet, some prefer a combination. People's definition of fun varies. I just spent a weekend that was very enjoyable taking in a variety of things Toronto has to offer, including the crazy packed Woofstock, the St. Lawrence Market, a play, a couple of sidewalk cafes, bike rides and more. That's the beauty of Toronto -- there is a ton of stuff to do and something for everyone.

And yeah, apparently condo owners do want to live by an airport. Take a look at the number of buildings in the area and how they've been selling. Expanding the airport hasn't seemed to be a problem (I've been in the area since before the expansion).
 
jn_12 said:
The other thing is, we've chosen not to centralize our attractions. If you visit Chicago you have little reason to venture beyond the central waterfront, whereas here you have to travel throughout the city to see the traditional attractions, which also means that people have to explore our communities and neighbourhoods, which I think many people would say is a strong suit for Toronto.
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Actually, Chicago has lots of great neighbourhoods too. Not sure why you would judge Chicago solely on its waterfront centre anymore than you would Toronto.

I'm going to cut Torontovibe some slack on his comments. I don't live in Toronto and wouldn't go out of my way to visit the waterfront there, quite frankly. Nice for locals though, I'm sure! The Malting Silos would have made a nice modern art gallery or Museum of Toronto or some such other 'attraction' to further build on the wider appeal of the waterfront.
 
Tewder said:
The Malting Silos would have made a nice modern art gallery or Museum of Toronto or some such other 'attraction' to further build on the wider appeal of the waterfront.
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They may yet. That area of QQ could certainly use an attraction-destination. IIRC past proposals haven't been able to secure funding.

Perhaps what's needed is a point person with a solid business plan and deep pockets.
 
Tewder said:
Actually, Chicago has lots of great neighbourhoods too. Not sure why you would judge Chicago solely on its waterfront centre anymore than you would Toronto. I'm going to cut Torontovibe some slack on his comments. I don't live in Toronto and wouldn't go out of my way to visit the waterfront there, quite frankly. Nice for locals though, I'm sure! The Malting Silos would have made a nice modern art gallery or Museum of Toronto or some such other 'attraction' to further build on the wider appeal of the waterfront.
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Oh, I agree, but if mass tourism is what you're after (which is what Torontovibe seems to be all about), then a tourist has no reason to leave Chicago's waterfront and could very well spend their entire vacation never seeing anything more than that area. Whereas here in Toronto, the lack of "tourist area" forces visitors to discover more of the city.

What's also funny is that I was speaking with some people from Washington today who were impressed with our waterfront. The wavedecks and HTO Park in particular were a real hit.
 
TTC station?

Yes TTC streetcars come close to the airport, but maybe not enough to take away significant street congestion.

Why not use the space here to create a true Billy Bishop LRT station. Make an underground loop station (like Spadina or St. Clair West) that takes in the Harbourfront, Exhibition, and Bathurst (and maybe future Lakeshore West) lines. It would provide a short-turn or-end-loop opportunity for any of those lines, and provide a weather-protected (and accessible with the new LRTs) direct route to Union Station.

Plus, if you do end up putting a museum in the rest of the silos, you now have a transit exit at its doorstep.
 
jn_12 said:
What's also funny is that I was speaking with some people from Washington today who were impressed with our waterfront. The wavedecks and HTO Park in particular were a real hit.
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I think that most people who come to Toronto are generally going to appreciate what's here, and all the more so given how under the radar it all is. Let's face it the expectations and preconceptions are going to be fairly different for Toronto than they are for certain other major urban centres in North America. In other words if you went to Chicago to find Toronto's waterfront you'd probably wonder what all the fuss was about... and this is not to come down on how things are progessing in Toronto but only to suggest it's simply not where it will be once QQ is complete and perhaps (hopefully) at least one major destination attraction is added into the mix.
 
jcam said:
Yes TTC streetcars come close to the airport, but maybe not enough to take away significant street congestion.

Why not use the space here to create a true Billy Bishop LRT station. Make an underground loop station (like Spadina or St. Clair West) that takes in the Harbourfront, Exhibition, and Bathurst (and maybe future Lakeshore West) lines. It would provide a short-turn or-end-loop opportunity for any of those lines, and provide a weather-protected (and accessible with the new LRTs) direct route to Union Station.

Plus, if you do end up putting a museum in the rest of the silos, you now have a transit exit at its doorstep.
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Good idea. As a temporary solution I'd like to see half the bathurst cars turning left and terminanting at the Spadina-Queens Quay loop. That would save walking across 8 lanes of Lakeshore with your luggage.
 
I hadn't heard of this plan yet, but sounds good...
From DCN....http://www.dailycommercialnews.com/...2e441c8cfaa1&projectid=9091068&region=ontario

MUSEUM, EDUCATIONAL, OFFICE BLDGS, RESTAURANT
Proj: 9091068-7
Toronto, Metro Toronto Reg ON
CONTEMPLATED
Canada Malting Co Plant lands, M5V 2N8
$100,000,000 est

Note:
This project is on hold. Consultant has completed a report recommending development on the site. Schedules for design, tender and construction are undetermined pending approval of capital funding. Further update spring 2013.

Project:
proposed development of lands adjacent to the Canada Malting Company plant. The proposed development on the site would include a Toronto Museum with exhibits in three themes, "gathering place", "Global village", and "city soul". The project may include heritage features will incorporate into the background of the existing building for office, classroom, restaurant and assembly spaces.

Development: New
Category:..Government offices; Public bldgs; Educational bldgs; Restaurants
 
That's welcome news, if true. The Canada Malting Silos could be a jewel of the waterfront, forever diversifying the built form of condos from the 1970s-2010s with a fascinatingly different heritage building that can make the area more interesting visually and culturally. It reminds us that there's an interesting history to the area, that before the condos there weren't mere green fields. For Toronto's history, the lake is a great starting point, and the silos are near Fort York and somewhat close to the Fort Rouille site as well. It should be linked to a lot of cultural programming around the building to create a welcoming, vibrant, and inviting atmosphere that draws people towards the building.
 
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First reported in 2008; still listed as contemplated, but revised June 28/12, so who knows?
 
I believe the Museum of Toronto idea for the silos was completely abandoned a couple of years ago in favour of a plan using the courtyard at Old City Hall.
 
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