St. Lawrence Market

[Edward]

The money they must make on Saturday, when the place is a total zoo, probably makes opening the rest of the week unnecessary for many of them.

But the city is losing out by having a tourist attraction closed on a day like Sunday. As landlord the city should insist they open on Sunday. Would the Eaton Centre allow any of their stores to close on a Sunday because they make too much money the rest of the week?

If they were forced to open Sundays and Mondays the owners would have to hire minimum wage help to cover those extra hours. Then you'd be served by the same indifferent and unknowledgeable 15-year-olds that staff Dominion and Sobeys and there'd be no point in going to the market at all.

I highly doubt that. The quality of the food changes depending on who is behind the counter?

 

[Urban Shocker]

Is buying cold cuts and tinned Spanish olives on a Sunday afternoon such a tourist attraction though, really?

 

[Hydrogen]

The whole neighbourhood is a tourist attraction.

Actually, it's a neighbourhood and the St. Lawrence Market is a market. The impression that it is a tourist attraction is just incidental.

But the city is losing out by having a tourist attraction closed on a day like Sunday. As landlord the city should insist they open on Sunday.

Edward, are you suggesting the city force merchants to stay open? Would it be a surprise then if many left and were replaced by such tourist standards as souvenir shops?

 

[299 bloor call control.]

Saturday is Market Day. St Lawrence Market is the Market. It is only to be open on Saturday. Locals are the vast majority who use said Market.

Saying the market should open on other days is like telling a church to hold Sunday Mass every day just so tourists can come in a gawk at the locals going about their business.

 

[Edward]

Edward, are you suggesting the city force merchants to stay open? Would it be a surprise then if many left and were replaced by such tourist standards as souvenir shops?

The city is the landlord and can insist in the terms of the lease that they must stay open on Sundays. And as landlord the city can keep souvenir and chain stores out.

But why would they leave? Business is so good they have the luxury of staying closed two days a week. I don't see many other retail businesses in the area doing this.

BTW, there are businesses located in the market that want a Sunday opening. The problem is they were outvoted by the majority. And since its either fully open or not at all these businesses have to stay closed.

 

[Urban Shocker]

Outvoted by the majority? Shocking, comrade!

 

[Therion]

Those pesky socio-commies and their pesky... umm, democratic process?

I would very much like St.L.M. to be open on Sundays, as it is the only day I could get down there, but I understand people need days off.

 

[Edward]

They can still have the day off. They just need to hire some additional employees.

 

[PukeGreen]

Actually, it's a neighbourhood and the St. Lawrence Market is a market. The impression that it is a tourist attraction is just incidental.

Agreed. Most of the south market is butchers, fish mongers, cheese shops and vegetable stalls. I don't know about you, but when I'm a tourist staying in a hotel the last thing I'm likely to buy is a rack of lamb, a few pounds of talapia and a head of broccoli. Those things don't survive the trip home in a suitcase very well.

Saturday's are by far the busiest day at the market, and there are many tourists, but if you look carefully it is mainly the locals doing the shopping and the tourists doing the gawking. During the week the market is very quiet, but those who are there are there to buy, either groceries or lunch, so the percentage of visitors who actually spend money is likely far higher than on Saturdays.

As for the neighbourhood, aside from those perpetually taking photos of the Flatiron, there's not much that is purely for tourists. It's a nice neighbourhood to live in, it has many attractive restored historic buildings, and it's a model of a walkable mixed-use/mixed-income community. That's why it's on the tourist circuit -- not vice versa.

They can still have the day off. They just need to hire some additional employees.

Again, much of what makes the market attractive is that the stalls are mainly family run by people who are knowledgeable about their product and eager to foster long-term customer relationships. Stick a bunch of part-time staffers in those stalls and the experience would diminish. It would also be expensive and I could easily see some of the more niche stores go under to be replaced by blander touristy crap. Right now the maple syrup and silly t-shirt vendors are in the minority and I hope it stays that way.

If anyone wants an example of the SLM should not become, visit the Chelsea Market in Manhattan. Sure it is a beautiful space and home to the Food Network and dozens of specialty shops; however, it is 100% tourist attraction. I can't really envision any local going to that place weekly to buy groceries. Even as a tourist I wouldn't go back, because there's nothing more to see: it is just a building, not an experience. But yup, it's open 7 days a week.

 

[Urban Shocker]

I "work" about a ten minute walk from the Market and I hardly ever go there during the week, though they open quite early. But there's something wonderful about the ritual of going there - and to the farmers market - on Saturdays, along with everyone else. It's part of the great participatory theatre of our city, all year long.

There's no real reason for the vendors to rearrange their lives and hire more staff to accommodate a few people who want to go there at other times, if they don't want to do so.

 

[Edward]

Actually, it's a neighbourhood and the St. Lawrence Market is a market. The impression that it is a tourist attraction is just incidental.

I guess the visitors information booth next to the main entrance is for the locals then?

And I see out of province tour buses parked next to the North Market all the time. It most certainly is a tourist attraction. Conde Nast Traveller, or a publication like that, recently named it one of the top 10 markets in the world. You think people reading that would come to town and then not check it out?

 

[adma]

And I see out of province tour buses parked next to the North Market all the time. It most certainly is a tourist attraction. Conde Nast Traveller, or a publication like that, recently named it one of the top 10 markets in the world. You think people reading that would come to town and then not check it out?

Paradoxical as this may sound, maybe it's top 10 for *not* having sold out to the tourist market through Sunday openings, etc?

 

[Tewder]

Wasn't there a plan for a reconstructed or revitalized north hall for the market? Maybe this would be a good compliment as a more touristy venue (a la Chelsea market) to go with the more authentic experience in the south market. Best of both worlds, so to speak.

 

[PukeGreen]

Paradoxical as this may sound, maybe it's top 10 for *not* having sold out to the tourist market through Sunday openings, etc?

Yes, this is what I'm trying to say in my typical long-winded manner. The market was a vibrant destination for locals first, which then lead it to become a place that is interesting for tourists.

While we should make some changes to encourage and help the tourists (the booth outside is brand new this spring, great idea) we need to be careful that in making the changes, we don't damage the real functioning of the market and actually make it less interesting for tourists and locals alike. That's what I'm afraid forced 7-day openings would do.

 

[freshcutgrass]

They can still have the day off. They just need to hire some additional employees.

...he said in a flip manner, having never operated a small, family-run, fresh market business.


Look...I'm quite sure these merchants are aware that they do not follow every "usual" retail guideline. They follow guidelines specific to their unique brand of service. That's why they open at 5:00AM on Saturdays.

Sure...the Dominion right across the street is open 24/7, yet people pack the Market on Saturdays. Why didn't the Market die the day Dominion opened their doors? Simple...although they may appear to be the same thing (stores that sell food), they are infact, two entirely different things.

This idea that everything must be available on-demand 24/7 is the exact reason everything now has a general level of suckness. Diddo for anything that cow-tows to tourists.