Shooting on the subway @ Osgoode station

[Mustapha]

Perhaps they are unafraid of the consequences once they are caught?

What ARE the consequences? Carrying. Waving it around. Using it. Attempting murder with it. Anyone here know? I only have experience with a relation who killed his wife with a shotgun. He was out in I think about 15 years. Then he was on welfare. Can you get welfare with a record?

 

[CDL.TO]

At 11:45am TTC announcements stated that the subway was closed from St. George to Union, so I hopped on the 512 to St. Clair Station. Heading southbound, we were booted off the train at Bloor and the train pulled out of the station back north. The announcements stated that the subway was now closed from Yonge-Bloor to St. George, with shuttle buses running. A couple minutes later said that the line was actually closed from Union to St. George.

Eventually another southbound train came along. I would say that we waited at Bloor Station for 15 minutes, so things were pretty damn crowded.

It's clear that the TTC still needs to improve their communications.

 

[299 bloor call control.]

The line was initially closed between St George and Union, however, ETF was searching the tunnels north and south of Osgoode Station, so power had to be shut off at Union briefly so they could do a quick sweep - that led to the closure of the line between Bloor-Yonge and St George.

The good news is that the subway is now running again, however, Osgoode Station remains closed, and trains will be running through the station and not stopping.

 

[dt_toronto_geek]

Osgoode station was still closed around 4:20 when I walked by

 

[Brian69]

What ARE the consequences? Carrying. Waving it around. Using it. Attempting murder with it. Anyone here know? I only have experience with a relation who killed his wife with a shotgun. He was out in I think about 15 years. Then he was on welfare. Can you get welfare with a record?

Good question. Looking at the Criminal Code doesn't seem to matter since everything seems to be plea bargained down. I'm sometimes amazed what can get changed from 1st degree to 2nd or 2nd to manslaughter, and to a lesser extent assault causing bodily harm versus attempted murder--when reading news reports what passes for lack of murderous intent is rather generous when in my opinion taking out a gun and pulling the trigger is intent enough.

Every career involves compromises while sometimes playing fast with the rules. It can be something of a nudge and wink game once you bury yourself within the system in order to get things done but justice needs to have higher standards.

 

[wonderboy416]

It's clear that the TTC still needs to improve their communications.

Will the TTC install videoboards in their stations that tell you when the next train is scheduled to arrive and in the event of a service stoppage give clear instructions as to where you should be going to catch a shuttle bus, ETA for resumption of service etc?

After commuting on the TTC every morning for over a year (Bloor and Yonge lines) I was amazed at how poor the communication was in emergency situations.. half the time you can't even hear the announcements clearly on the trains or platforms. Simply having info boards on every train and over the platforms would help resolve this and help the TTC put out a consistent message in the event of a crisis.

 

[Admiral Beez]

I suggest that every TTC station and/or platform have an armed, on-duty police officer, or even better two. Every train should have an tazer-armed TTC-cop on-board. You need to get tough with these thugs from scarlem and the projects. We've always had poverty-ridden populations, just look at how Ed Mirvish grew up for instances of real poverty. But this is the first group of have'nots that's started shooting up the community at large.

 

[000]

Photo released: http://www.torontopolice.on.ca/newsreleases/pdfs/15723.pdf

 

[dt_toronto_geek]

Nearly half a billion people ride the TTC a year, how many shootings are there? The problems causing these events (guns, gangs, drugs etc.) need to be addressed and dealt a furious blow. We don't need police on every train, bus and street corner - sounds a little NYC post 9/11 to me and I personally want no part of that.

 

[waterloowarrior]

I suggest that every TTC station and/or platform have an armed, on-duty police officer, or even better two. Every train should have an tazer-armed TTC-cop on-board. You need to get tough with these thugs from scarlem and the projects. We've always had poverty-ridden populations, just look at how Ed Mirvish grew up for instances of real poverty. But this is the first group of have'nots that's started shooting up the community at large.

Maybe the 401 should have checkpoints and armed guards too

http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/article/575987

Part of Highway 401 closed after car shot at
January 22, 2009
HENRY STANCU
STAFF REPORTER
Police have closed part of the westbound Highway 401 in Etobicoke after a car was shot at.

A window was shattered and two of the vehicle's four occupants was cut by glass in the incident, which occurred on the 401 near Kipling Ave. at about 10 p.m.

The Honda Civic veered into the south guard rail where it came to a stop before the occupants got out, ran across the roadway, over the north guardrail, and vaulted a mesh fence.

They ran for help to Fitness 365, a gym on Ronson Dr., which runs parallel to the highway.

Two men suffered cuts to the face from flying glass in the shooting. One was taken to Humber River Regional Hospital (Church site) and the other was treated by an ambulance crew at the scene. Both men's injuries were considered minor.

Police were trying to determine if the gunshot came from another vehicle on the highway or Ronson Dr., which runs parallel to the 401.

Toronto police and the OPP locked down the gym, not allowing anyone in or out, until they were able to question the victims and get information from any witnesses at the gym.

Traffic was virtually at a standstill shortly after 11 p.m.

 

[egotrippin]

That must explain the fury of police cars that came flying out of the 51 division and straight for the highway that blew by me earlier. Even unmarked civilian cars blew out of the station, through a red light and bolted it up Adelaide to the DVP. It was nuts.

And on the topic of the subway shooting, I'm getting really sick of these gang related shootings. All shootings in general bother me, but these people have no regard for others as they fire willingly in crowded areas. Once prosecuted the scum responsible had better get put away for life, but I doubt that'll happen.

 

[wonderboy416]

And on the topic of the subway shooting, I'm getting really sick of these gang related shootings. All shootings in general bother me, but these people have no regard for others as they fire willingly in crowded areas. Once prosecuted the scum responsible had better get put away for life, but I doubt that'll happen.

Gangs are like cockroaches. No matter how many you get rid of they'll keep finding a way to come back with new members. Look at how many people in the US are being locked up every day as a result of gang crimes, their prisons are overflowing. Yet gang-related crime continues to ravage many US cities. I don't know what the solution is but locking these people up isn't going to end the madness if Toronto gangs are anything at all like their US counterparts.

 

[Admiral Beez]

Gangs are like cockroaches. No matter how many you get rid of they'll keep finding a way to come back with new members. Look at how many people in the US are being locked up every day as a result of gang crimes, their prisons are overflowing. Yet gang-related crime continues to ravage many US cities. I don't know what the solution is but locking these people up isn't going to end the madness if Toronto gangs are anything at all like their US counterparts.

Unlike US cities, our gang culture seems to be within one specific demographic, that of the young black, Caribbean-origin males. It really is that specific, it's not the black women, it's not the older black males, and it's not the blacks of African-origin. We do not have Asian, Russian or Italian gangs . Sure, we have ethnicity-based organized crime, plus Hells Angels type crime groups, but these groups seldom conduct themselves in such public brazen shoot-outs, and usually have organized hierarchy, with hits/murders being sanctioned by the leadership. These young, black males of Caribbean origin seem to simply shoot at each other whenever they see each other, regardless of the consequences to themselves or their organization.

Thus, I'd say we're different from US cities, since we just need to deal with this one group, since they're responsible for essentially every shooting in public spaces. Eliminate this threat, and Toronto's murder rate will be less than 20 per year, IMO, and shootings on the streets and public transit will be all but history.

 

[confusion]

I think it is not legitimate to categorize city gangs by race, but rather by city locale. I work and play soccer near many blacks, latinos, and I know for a fact that many of these individuals are good, hard-working people. To generalize them in with a crime-ridden sub-culture is wrong.

Sure there may be a heavier influence from one demographic than another in the gang, but this is Canada. Even gangs are multicultural. It is surely not limited as it might be in locations stateside.

 

[Tewder]

Admiral Beez, there are gangs out there of all different ethnic/cultural backgrounds (Hells Angels, Maffia, etc) and there are Asian gangs and Terrorist cels and all kinds of other nefarious groups. You are correct though in that for the most part unless you are involved with those groups directly you are not likely to get personally injured. Black gang crime on the other hand is being waged in the public spaces. No question. The question is what to do about it? We don't seem to be able to stop the activities of the Maffia or other groups so how can we expect to be able to stop the activities of this one group in particular, and all the more so when there are enormously powerful racial sensitivites involved? Toronto simply does not have the backbone or grit to tackle these problems like NYC has done for example and the result is that the streets there feel more safe, imo. Crime will always happen and I wouldn't say that crime in Toronto is out of control, but it does seem to brew under the surface, breaking out in the type of sporadic incidents we saw yesterday which doesn't make one feel cozy.