Sheppard Line 4 Subway Extension (Proposed)

[BurlOak]

The transfer isn't in Fairview Mall. It's in the subway station. You don't need to enter Fairview Mall.

All you have to do is walk out of your subway car, walk across a relatively narrow platform, and into an LRT car. It's a far easier transfer than either much busier Yonge-Bloor or St. George. Should we eliminate those as well?

We already did get rid of those transfers right from the design. If you are continuing straight (either straight north-south or east-west), then no transfer is needed at Y-B or St. George.

 

[Rainforest]

I just think that other lines should be considered first (like say perhaps a North-South route elsewhere in the city) before even thinking about building both a line along Sheppard East and Finch East. I'm not even sure if there is any talk of Finch East line, but there's certainly discussion about Sheppard East.
Essentially because the Sheppard Subway already exists. If it didn't, Finch straight across the city makes the most sense.

There is no official plans or funding for the Finch East line, but it kind of makes sense in combination with Finch West which is already on the books. Also, Finch East bus is busier than any north-south bus route with the exception of Dufferin (but an LRT on Dufferin would have to overcome a lot of challenges).

Anyway, we are discussing a lot of hypothetical scenarios in this thread. There are no official plans or funding for a Sheppard subway conversion, for a Sheppard subway extension in any form, or for combining Finch and Sheppard LRTs. If we are discussing all those options and assume that one of them can be funded one day, then we can as well consider parallel Finch and Sheppard routes. IMO, such scheme is more straightforward, and is likely cheaper, than many other options debated here.

 

[M II A II R II K]

The Sheppard line will become one continuous line eventually in some form or fashion.

 

[Bojaxs]

Creating a transfer at Fairview Mall will not be practical in the future. You either do the LRT conversion or build the subway in full.

It should be a seamless RT route to Scarborough City Centre.

Either convert the existing Sheppard subway to LRT or extend the subway to SCC. From there people can transfer to buses to the suburbs surrounding SCC.

Having to make a transfer on a RT route just so you can keep going in the same direction is typical Toronto planning/ mentality.

 

[ehlow]

It should be a seamless RT route to Scarborough City Centre.

Either convert the existing Sheppard subway to LRT or extend the subway to SCC. From there people can transfer to buses to the suburbs surrounding SCC.

Having to make a transfer on a RT route just so you can keep going in the same direction is typical Toronto planning/ mentality.

It won't go to STC whether it's a subway or LRT, because the Scarborough Subway goes up to Sheppard. The current Scarborough Subway aka Danforth extension plan goes to Sheppard and McCowan. So whatever happens on Sheppard, if anything, would likely meet the Scarborough/Danforth subway there.

 

[W. K. Lis]

There is also discussions that the DRL maybe extended in phases up Don Mills to Sheppard, making the Don Mills station a natural transfer station.

 

[nfitz]

We already did get rid of those transfers right from the design. If you are continuing straight (either straight north-south or east-west), then no transfer is needed at Y-B or St. George.

I guess that's why I never see anyone transferring at Y-B.

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

It should be a seamless RT route to Scarborough City Centre.

Either convert the existing Sheppard subway to LRT or extend the subway to SCC. From there people can transfer to buses to the suburbs surrounding SCC.

Having to make a transfer on a RT route just so you can keep going in the same direction is typical Toronto planning/ mentality.

Agreed.

It won't go to STC whether it's a subway or LRT, because the Scarborough Subway goes up to Sheppard. The current Scarborough Subway aka Danforth extension plan goes to Sheppard and McCowan. So whatever happens on Sheppard, if anything, would likely meet the Scarborough/Danforth subway there.

That depends on the next council. If Olivia wins, she will want out of the subway. Keep in mind, there is not real way to put a station at STC on the McCowan alignment without making an inward curve towards STC. There will be stops at Ellesmere and Eglinton/Danforth instead I bet if this McCowan alignment happens.

There is also discussions that the DRL maybe extended in phases up Don Mills to Sheppard, making the Don Mills station a natural transfer station.

I agree 100 percent with that, I have been saying as much for years.
Then they should change the name of the Don Mills station. Lawrence/Don Mills should be "Don Mills Center" and the current station should be "Fairview Mall"

 

[ssiguy2]

If they are going to go ahead with Sheppard I think the priority should be the Spadina to Yonge section first. Although the TTC in it's infinite wisdom decided to make the stations grandiose as opposed to practical such as building an east/west station at Sheppard West Spadina station for an eventual Sheppard subway, it still makes the most sense.

It gets rid of a ridiculous transfer at Yonge and would greatly increase traffic on the Sheppard Line. The Sheppard line with a Spadina ext will become MUCH busier once the Spadina ext is open. A lot of east/west travellers still take Finch or Steels because the stubway isn't worth the bother of getting off an transferring for 4 stupid stops. That would not be the case if it went all the way to Spadina were, at 10km, it would actually make a real dent in east/west travel.

 

[BurlOak]

We already did get rid of those transfers right from the design. If you are continuing straight (either straight north-south or east-west), then no transfer is needed at Y-B or St. George.

I guess that's why I never see anyone transferring at Y-B.

You mean that people get off the train and run forward to the next car?

I don't stick around long enough to know if someone gets of the train and then gets on the very next train on the same line. Maybe if there are a lot of these people that explains the crowding at the stations.

 

[M II A II R II K]

Maybe a westerly Sheppard extension could veer north and take the place of the Finch West LRT. Perhaps by interlining the Sheppard trains from Sheppard West to Finch West without having to build any extra platforms at those stations and just use the same ones.

 

[nfitz]

You mean that people get off the train and run forward to the next car?

Uh ... no.

 

[johntauren]

Maybe a westerly Sheppard extension could veer north and take the place of the Finch West LRT. Perhaps by interlining the Sheppard trains from Sheppard West to Finch West without having to build any extra platforms at those stations and just use the same ones.

It's good idea.
But the interlining wouldn't work at Finch West or at current Downsview because the platforms are laid out north-south directly under Finch and Sheppard.
You'd end up with something more like Spadina station at both ends.

 

[Hopkins123]

Keep in mind, there is not real way to put a station at STC on the McCowan alignment without making an inward curve towards STC. There will be stops at Ellesmere and Eglinton/Danforth instead I bet if this McCowan alignment happens.
I agree 100 percent with that, I have been saying as much for years.
Then they should change the name of the Don Mills station. Lawrence/Don Mills should be "Don Mills Center" and the current station should be "Fairview Mall"

You mean like this:



The alignment I chose follows underneath Packard Blvd. which runs on a diagonal from the McCowan/Brimorton area to Ellesmere near Borough Approach West, where it then curves east to meet the existing transit hub before rejoining McCowan via cutting through the Town Centre parking lot.

 

[dowlingm]

Interlining Sheppard and Spadina would require two connections to be added, complicating signalling and forcing disruptions to what is a pretty new subway line. Not happening, I think. Best thing to hope for would be a single connection to allow equipment movement between the two lines

If the line was routed through the parklands running northwest between Sheppard-Easton and Finch-Wilmington with a possible infill station at Bathurst-Ellerslie it might be doable but pricey (and I haven't looked at elevations), and proposing it would risk substantial blowback from both park users and potentially cemetery ones too.

Better to build Finch as LRT now, and reserve a Sheppard extension for a post-Bombardier Downsview redevelopment scenario either as subway or as an extension of an LRT retrofit to the existing stub line ("Crosstown 2 - Electric Boogaloo!").