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Sheppard Line 4 Subway Extension (Proposed)

DB9 said:
Yes, regular people don't have the time or understanding. They expect politicians will uphold their fiduciary duty and not appeal to their lowest denominator. To uphold their professional duty and pick the choices best for Scarborough. Cho is a clear example of a crass politician who brings out the cynicism in all of us - subway to the zoo? Who is he kidding? Promising free subways with development charges is also a vote winner, but where did that get us?

However, there are politicians who do way above and beyond their fiduciary duty - Joe Cressey, Mike Layton, etc.. Not everyone is a realpolitik. We could use a few of them in Scarborough.
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I get that you are happy with Cressey and Layton, they work hard for sure but they are doing what appeases to you and to other constitutes just like many Scarborough councillors do for their constituents which goes far beyond the subway debate. I think you are somewhat disconnected from seeing what goes on in these communities. And how happy many are as well.

kEiThZ said:
Malvern doesn't care. After the original LRT cut the last stop back to Sheppard and Progress (barely touching Malvern), the LRT plan became a lot less appealing. I heard several friends and neighbours say the LRT wasn't coming to Malvern. And that was sorta true....with the terminus at Progress and Sheppard. As a result, I saw my incompetent councillor (Raymond Cho) elected in the recent by-election as MPP on a pledge to support the subway to SCC.
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The support for subway is real, as far as fringe areas like Malvern which surround SCC and the Sheppard subway, they just want the debate to end(check the bi-election results and Shans comments on this topic). So they will vote for action. This is what we are sure to see once again at election time amidst the noise assault coming from mostly outside Councillors, many of who reside in subway ridings which already have, or are near potential subway stops. And many of them have a political ties to a transit special interest group and ties to a heavily political local media which clearly intends to focus on the small minority in Scarborough residents to cause trouble and convince outsiders that there is support to go backwards to the old reject LRT plan. All this noise will only make it easier for Tory or a Ford type (indications are hes going Provincial) in Scarborough IMO as people have had enough of this debate to nowhere. There were better way to connect the heart of Scarborough, but when there is no wiggle room to respect the majority democratic vote from outside opposition and the only option the opposition is offering to a one stop subway is the transfer LRT plan already rejected, then were more likely to get the one stop subway.

The support for subway and the support for action is far larger than any support to stop the subway and spend more money and time to study the old transfer LRT plan and then have further plans come out and study further and so and so on. Its no longer shovel ready, it not longer under $2B, and its still have the same transfer before SCC that gave fuel to change the plan. The idea of pushing this plan again is absolute political stubbornness likely stemming from what happened 7 years ago. That's the only reason I can see for these Politicians to continue to be this unwilling to work to resolve the connectivity issue at hand. Its an issue.
 
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It's been talked about a million times before, I'm sure, but if we're going to improve GO RER service to North York (and the rest of the 416) -- which is surely a good idea, insofar as the tracks are already there -- I truly don't understand why we can't find a solution so that there is no extra fare. In other words, that it's simply part of the TTC 416 zone.

Like, it seems nuts to me that we bemoan the absence of the Relief Line, but that we don't spend a tiny fraction of that on the difference between the GO and the TTC fare for those who take the Sheppard line to Leslie and are willing to do the walk to Oriole to catch the GO train. Isn't that the most straight-forward first step towards building demand for non-Yonge-Line transit in the 416? As word got out that, for the same fare, you could shift over to the GO line and get an express trip, wouldn't more and more of those for whom it was efficient to do so, actually do it?

It's no panacea, but in terms of ungumming the works, wouldn't this be a simple one? Is it all a question of in-fighting about who reimburses Metrolinx for those passengers?
 
Disparishun said:
It's been talked about a million times before, I'm sure, but if we're going to improve GO RER service to North York (and the rest of the 416) -- which is surely a good idea, insofar as the tracks are already there -- I truly don't understand why we can't find a solution so that there is no extra fare. In other words, that it's simply part of the TTC 416 zone.

Like, it seems nuts to me that we bemoan the absence of the Relief Line, but that we don't spend a tiny fraction of that on the difference between the GO and the TTC fare for those who take the Sheppard line to Leslie and are willing to do the walk to Oriole to catch the GO train. Isn't that the most straight-forward first step towards building demand for non-Yonge-Line transit in the 416? As word got out that, for the same fare, you could shift over to the GO line and get an express trip, wouldn't more and more of those for whom it was efficient to do so, actually do it?

It's no panacea, but in terms of ungumming the works, wouldn't this be a simple one? Is it all a question of in-fighting about who reimburses Metrolinx for those passengers?
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Even without fare integration, if they simply moved the Oriole GO station to a more transfer-friendly location above Leslie Station you'd probably see an uptick in transfers simply due to the convenience factor and elimination of a 5-10 minute uncomfortable walk (depending on walking ability).

I believe this was initially the plan, but for whatever reason it seems like there's no appetite for moving the station? (anyone have any info on it?)
 
BMO said:
Even without fare integration, if they simply moved the Oriole GO station to a more transfer-friendly location above Leslie Station you'd probably see an uptick in transfers simply due to the convenience factor and elimination of a 5-10 minute uncomfortable walk (depending on walking ability).
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Agreed, but I'm kind of thinking to start upstream from there. Making GO transit part of the 416 TTC zone (no additional fare) would surely drive demand and raise questions as to why the heck noone bit down on the physical relocation. The more people making that trek (because it's now at no additional cost) ... the more people looking into whether they'd do it, but for the trek ... the more questions are asked as to what the hold-up is.

More broadly, though. Wouldn't it always be cheaper to subsidize the transfers, by making them no-additional-cost, than to build additional new transit to capture those very same riders?
 
BMO said:
Even without fare integration, if they simply moved the Oriole GO station to a more transfer-friendly location above Leslie Station you'd probably see an uptick in transfers simply due to the convenience factor and elimination of a 5-10 minute uncomfortable walk (depending on walking ability).

I believe this was initially the plan, but for whatever reason it seems like there's no appetite for moving the station? (anyone have any info on it?)
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I don't see this happening anytime soon with the Relief Line and extensions on the table.
 
innsertnamehere said:
how exactly does that one work? the RH line doesn't go anywhere near Newmarket.
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I think he just means to have a Davis Drive Station on the Richmond Hill Line. However, I don't think that will be necessary as it in on the opposite side of Highway 404. But knowing how GO stations are placed, it will probably be a future station :p
 
Where the Bala Sub intersects with Davis drive there is quite the elevation difference as well as a significant curve on the rail line at that point. Both issues would make for difficult operation of a station at that exact intersection.
 
Poll results review: What is the best next transit upgrade in the Sheppard East corridor, http://urbantoronto.ca/forum/thread...-upgrade-in-the-sheppard-east-corridor.27696/

29 people voted. Up to 3 choices were allowed; 41 votes received. Observations:

1) Preferred mode of transit:
LRT (in any form, options 3,4,5): 19 votes
Subway (in any form, options 1,2,6): 16 votes
Enhanced bus service (option 7): 6 votes

LRT is in the lead, but subway isn't far behind.

2) Retention of transfer at Don Mills
Eliminate the transfer (options 1,2,4,5,6): 32 votes
Keep the transfer (options 3,7): 9 votes

A clear majority wants the transfer removed.

3) Projects that TTC or Metrolinx reviewed, vs alternative proposals:
Projects officially reviewed within the last 10 years (options 1,3,4): 14 votes
Alternative proposals (options 2,5,6,7): 27 votes

I can only hope that TTC/Metrolinx will be open-minded and will consider those alternatives.

4) Option 5, "Convert and extend as high-floor LRT that can fit into the subway tunnel more easily", won the plurality. Out of 29 people voted, 14 feel this option is viable.
 
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