ChesterCopperpot
Senior Member
Oh goodness - look what's working (the fountains at Queen and University if you aren't on Instagram)
https://instagram.com/p/2rOOFymp0S/
https://instagram.com/p/2rOOFymp0S/
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Shabby Public Realm
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Torontovibe
Senior Member
I always hear Lynda Reeves referring to things as "shabby chic". I wonder if that term could apply to Toronto? lol "Come visit the shabby chic streets of Toronto and see how we make rusty street poles and dilapidation look cool"
maestro
Senior Member
Well the chipped paint/concrete is rather benign to street vibrancy compared to the reckless abandonment you see in neighboring cities.
MisterF
Senior Member
I assume you're talking about the likes of Buffalo and Detroit? If that's where we're setting the bar then I think I've found the problem.
Adjei
Senior Member
I saw these streetligts on a street downtown and wonder why they don't use these more on our main streets instead of the gray or silver ones they use which rust too quickly and don't look good. For example the ones they used on the Bloor Revitalization. These would have looked much better IMHO and they are black which stands out more compared to the grey/silver.
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allabootmatt
Senior Member
Toronto's insistence on using grey for everything is a habit I have never understood. The new(ish) garbage bins are a case in point.
Other cities seem to use black as the default colour and yes, it's much sharper. You see this in Montreal, Vancouver, New York, Boston...the list goes on.
These lights -- which judging by the location might be a private installation by the property owner? -- remind me a lot of the new ones on Sherbrooke in Montreal, which look great.
Other cities seem to use black as the default colour and yes, it's much sharper. You see this in Montreal, Vancouver, New York, Boston...the list goes on.
These lights -- which judging by the location might be a private installation by the property owner? -- remind me a lot of the new ones on Sherbrooke in Montreal, which look great.
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Adjei
Senior Member
It was on Lourdes Lane which is in the Sherbourne and Wellsley area. They look very nice and wish they used more often. You are probably right that the property owner paid for them. I can't see Toronto's cheap self paying for higher quality ones on a side street.
I think the reason why grey is used for everything is because it's the cheapest that is available. It sure isn't for how good it looks. Since everything in Toronto is about using the cheapest option available what do you expect? Screw how it looks.
There are also black ones on Yonge Street but I think the BIA paid for those. I was shocked that they defaulted to the grey ones on Bloor Street instead of something better and sleeker. But this is Toronto so I shouldn't be surprised.
DSC
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When the street lighting on The Esplanade was redone a few years ago, when the lights on Front Street east of Jarvis were redone in 2013 and as Lower Sherbourne is being done now the new light poles are all black. The St Lawrence BIA asked Hydro to install black poles and they did so. Unfortunately the City Transportation guys do not seem to have access to black traffic light poles so they are the standard grey unpainted metal. The BIA is thinking about painting them. The Stresscrete colour charts are at http://www.stresscretegroup.com/Str...tdownloads/Concrete-Decor-Colors-Brochure.pdf
AlvinofDiaspar
Moderator
Personally I prefer stainless for street furniture over black, but the latter does hide unsightly stains well.
re: light standard - they resemble the ones used along the Yonge BIA stretch.
(from City of Toronto)
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maestro
Senior Member
Just about any American city within driving distance will have levels of abandonment that simply doesn't not exist in Toronto. They are off the beaten path from the pristine touristy areas.
Adjei
Senior Member
Why do always find the need to compare ourselves to Americans as if they are the standard we should aspire to. Why not compare ourselves to other global cities like Amsterdam, Berlin, Sydney, or Melbourne?
The insistence on not just people from Toronto but Canadians as a whole to measure ourselves against Americans as default is frustrating. Americans are not the best at everything. They are not the standard to measure to. We should strive for the best and not just to be better than Americans. You see the same thing with our healthcare system where Canadians are happy to celebrate that our system is better than Americans. Meanwhile if we look at the countries in the OECD, we are close to the bottom for healthcare for a lot of the indicators. Do you think Americans are just striving to be better than Canada? They are trying to the best.
The insistence on not just people from Toronto but Canadians as a whole to measure ourselves against Americans as default is frustrating. Americans are not the best at everything. They are not the standard to measure to. We should strive for the best and not just to be better than Americans. You see the same thing with our healthcare system where Canadians are happy to celebrate that our system is better than Americans. Meanwhile if we look at the countries in the OECD, we are close to the bottom for healthcare for a lot of the indicators. Do you think Americans are just striving to be better than Canada? They are trying to the best.
Riverdale Rink Rat
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Well, I'd say we compare our city infrastructure to other comparable cities, ones that were built at approximately the same time and in the same way. Comparing Toronto to Melbourne would probably be a pretty fair comparison, but so's Chicago. Amsterdam, on the other hand, is hundreds of years older and has had many different challenges than Toronto has faced or will face in city building.
As for your healthcare comment: The OECD seems to think we're in the upper third of its members with respect to healthcare --
http://www.oecd.org/els/health-systems/Briefing-Note-CANADA-2014.pdf
They laud us on reduction of smoking and drinking and comment that obesity is starting to make an impact, which seems like a reasonable analysis of Canadian healthcare.
AlvinofDiaspar
Moderator
On the topic of healthcare, I would be very, very careful comparing apples to oranges to lemons - the systems in different countries are vastly different in how they are funded and operated, and health outcomes are subjected to significant lifestyle differences. We should learn from other countries, by all means, but avoid worshipping them - it's often a matter of choosing outcomes you, as a society, is willing to live with.
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MisterF
Senior Member
Yes, what I meant was that we should be setting the bar higher than the Rustbelt cities across the border. But even those declining cities that have lost half their population tend to have better streetscaping standards than Toronto.
As for Amsterdam and other cities centuries older, I just don't think that's relevant. It doesn't take centuries to build quality streetscapes. Any street can be rebuilt in a matter of years at most. A citywide commitment to improving the public realm would see large scale improvement within a decade or two. The age of the city is a non-factor and we really need to stop using it as an excuse.
As for Amsterdam and other cities centuries older, I just don't think that's relevant. It doesn't take centuries to build quality streetscapes. Any street can be rebuilt in a matter of years at most. A citywide commitment to improving the public realm would see large scale improvement within a decade or two. The age of the city is a non-factor and we really need to stop using it as an excuse.
Tewder
Senior Member
Agreed. These efforts can be transformative. In those areas where Toronto has made an effort we see what potential this city truly has, and it really isn't about 'sooper talls'. Just need to see more of it... of course it doesn't help that the city has been in a virtual construction zone mess for about 15 years.