Saks Fifth Avenue Flagship (Queen & Yonge)

[Tuscani01]

No announcement has been made regarding the status of the Yonge/Bloor Saks, according to a friend of mine who works for HBC and hasn't heard anything internally about it being cancelled. The location at Yonge/Queen will not carry the full product assortment of a normal Sak's so take what you want from that.

 

[interchange42]

The article in the Globe, containing interviews with Richard Baker of HBC and CadFair CEO John Sullivan, indicates that the Queen/Yonge Saks will be "full line" and that Bloor/Yonge is not going to happen.

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[Tuscani01]

The article in the Globe, containing interviews with Richard Baker of HBC and CadFair CEO John Sullivan, indicates that the Queen/Yonge Saks will be "full line" and that Bloor/Yonge is not going to happen.

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Internally, they were told Sherway is full-line, and Yonge/Queen is not. There may have been a miscommunication in the interview, but more information will be coming out soon.

 

[Filip]

This is turning out into a hot mess.

Maybe we'll end up with a half line Saks at Queen/Yonge and then a full line Saks in the suburbs? Jeez...

 

[Bayer]

Nice about the bridge. Now if only CF could partner with the TTC to improve the dismal subway-level connection between the Eaton Centre and the store, that would be even better.

 

[Filip]

Read the updated Globe article. Seems like Brookfield really dropped the ball on this one. They're mostly to blame. CF capitalized on an excellent opportunity and closed the deal.

I'm interested to see how this is executed. Possibly Saks will take over the portion towards Simpson Tower leaving the rest of the heritage structure for Hudson's Bay. I hope it's fully vertically segregated and 'looks' like two distinct department stores.

I think this is the wrong location for Saks, but each to their own. It does make sense, but Brookfield should do some soul searching. They could have finally put that Bay to good use...

 

[thecharioteer]

Maybe they'll pull a rabbit out of their hat and announce a Bloomingdale's on Bloor?

Agree with your comment about vertical separation between the stores, Filip. Perhaps the bridge to TEC should open onto a "neutral" atrium-like space with the two department stores on either side.

 

[ksun]

Maybe they'll pull a rabbit out of their hat and announce a Bloomingdale's on Bloor?

Agree with your comment about vertical separation between the stores, Filip. Perhaps the bridge to TEC should open onto a "neutral" atrium-like space with the two department stores on either side.

I was hoping for a Neiman Marcus but apparently it won't happen any time soon

http://www.torontolife.com/style/toronto-shopping/2014/01/09/neiman-marcus-not-coming-to-canada/

I somehow agree with devjohnson that Toronto probably can't support that kind of high end retail on a full scale like cities such as NYC, LA or Chicago. I actually think Saks won't do very well unless they price aggressively. We probably don't have as many poverty as those American cities, but the flip side is that we don't have nearly as many rich people either. It is not uncommon for a 28 year old with good education to earn more than $100k a year in LA, but to do that in Toronto is tough.

 

[taal]

I was hoping for a Neiman Marcus but apparently it won't happen any time soon

http://www.torontolife.com/style/toronto-shopping/2014/01/09/neiman-marcus-not-coming-to-canada/

I somehow agree with devjohnson that Toronto probably can't support that kind of high end retail on a full scale like cities such as NYC, LA or Chicago. I actually think Saks won't do very well unless they price aggressively. We probably don't have as many poverty as those American cities, but the flip side is that we don't have nearly as many rich people either. It is not uncommon for a 28 year old with good education to earn more than $100k a year in LA, but to do that in Toronto is tough.

I completely agree and make this argument all the time but others seem to disagree.

I think the other very clear problem is ... Yorkdale ... this has really eaton out of what the luxury market used to soley be (downtown .. namely Bloor / Yorkville).
Bayview village is also like this but too a much lesser extent.

 

[TrickyRicky]

Taal, I think you are right about Yordale being highly successful to an extent at the expense of downtown retailers. On the other hand downtown has more of a monopoly on tourist dollars.

I do think there will be a rise in business for luxury goods downtown associated with the condo boom. My logic is that condo dwellers are more likely to use their disposable income for expensive vanity goods. Toronto is much richer than people here think (one study I cited elsewhere suggests that Toronto actually has more millionaires than Chicago and almost as many as LA if you can believe it). The issue for luxury retailers is how does this wealth translate into luxury goods purchases? I think in Toronto the amount of luxury goods people purchase is low because wealthy people use their money to buy bigger homes or another vehicle or a vacation property etc. rather than clothes or hand bags. Travelling in Eastern Europe and Asia I could see that people even of modest means spend money on luxury purchases. On the other hand most of the people I know with higher net worth do not purchase such goods regularly.

 

[gabe]

Taal, I think you are right about Yordale being highly successful to an extent at the expense of downtown retailers. On the other hand downtown has more of a monopoly on tourist dollars.

I do think there will be a rise in business for luxury goods downtown associated with the condo boom. My logic is that condo dwellers are more likely to use their disposable income for expensive vanity goods. Toronto is much richer than people here think (one study I cited elsewhere suggests that Toronto actually has more millionaires than Chicago and almost as many as LA if you can believe it). The issue for luxury retailers is how does this wealth translate into luxury goods purchases? I think in Toronto the amount of luxury goods people purchase is low because wealthy people use their money to buy bigger homes or another vehicle or a vacation property etc. rather than clothes or hand bags. Travelling in Eastern Europe and Asia I could see that people even of modest means spend money on luxury purchases. On the other hand most of the people I know with higher net worth do not purchase such goods regularly.

We may have more millionaires but America has way more materialistic suburbanites than us.

 

[CN Tower]

Interesting that Cadillac Fairview will now own the Eaton Centre and this massive complex, along with the four attached office towers. Along with getting the second Saks at Sherway, this is a huge win for them.

Really? I see it as a huge gamble. $650,000,000 into a sector that is dying, ie department stores.

 

[CN Tower]

Toronto is much richer than people here think (one study I cited elsewhere suggests that Toronto actually has more millionaires than Chicago and almost as many as LA if you can believe it).

I'm sure you are just referring to the City of Los Angeles proper vs. the City of Toronto in which case it's completely irrelevant and misleading.

 

[Edward Skira]

$650,000,000 into a sector that is dying, ie department stores.

That money is for the real estate (Bay store plus Simpson Tower). They are not buying a department store.

 

[taal]

That's why they were forced to sign a 25 years lease ... ! If it weren't for that, then sure its a huge risk.

Real estate sure but clearly there won't be any development possibilities on the site, so they've invested it in a huge building and a fairly old office building (which will surely face fierce competition from new builds as I don't believe its been renovated recently).

It is a risk.


With that said ... have a look at the price ... its probably reflected in that to a certain degree ... Scotia bank tower sold for 1.3 billion ... this for half that, and square footage wise its just as large, if not slightly larger when you add up both the giant bay building + the office tower.