Rouge Bijou (Downtown Markham, Remington, 10 + 3x 7s, Quadrangle)

[ShonTron]

That's true. Many empty nesters like the idea of living close to their last residence, because that's where their friends are. I'm sure that trend is driving a lot of the condo growth in MCC, for example, and the batch of new condos U/C or proposed in Brampton, Richmond Hill and Markham.

 

[scarberiankhatru]

A lot of people like the lack of maintenance and upkeep on a condo.

If you buy a newish, well-built house, there often isn't much maintenance that needs to be done and a lot of daily household toil is either exaggerated or chosen. You can pay someone to cut your grass or shovel snow, or just not do those things...and based on some of the houses I've seen in Markham, people can and do get away without keeping up their houses.

Oh, and it's not just empty-nesters...kids that have grown up in the suburbs often buy relatively cheap suburban condos as their initial foray into real estate, or new immigrants that have friends/family in the suburbs might move in, etc. Many people would love to live downtown, but their lives take place in the suburbs so moving downtown really doesn't make sense.

 

[Andrew3D]

325 jobs shifting to Markham
Peter Kuitenbrouwer, National Post
Published: Wednesday, May 23, 2007

A division of the U.S. industrial supplies giant Honeywell Corp. will announce this morning that it is moving 325 jobs out of Toronto to Markham, continuing the shift that has seen Toronto lose office jobs to the burgeoning 905 region.

Honeywell Building Solutions, which helps big commercial and industrial clients with heating, ventilation and air conditioning, along with lighting and other challenges, currently has its Canadian office at Victoria Park and Sheppard Avenue, in Scarborough.

But this morning at a ceremony in a new development called "Downtown Markham," Honeywell will announce plans to move here in about a year.

Cranes are already at work at the building site, adjacent to one occupied by Motorola. IBM has a big new facility on the other side of Warden Avenue.

"Markham is leading the way in sustainable development," said Luis Rodrigues, vice-president of energy solutions at Honeywell Canada.

 

[edwin]

In my opinion, most people are buying for investment purposes. If there is going to be a 'downtown', there better be people around. This means a huge opportunity for the rental market.

What I still don't get is the values of those condos. I think they are very much overpriced. You basically can get a much larger house nearby for the same price.

I am very skeptical about how this anti-sprawl picture is often painted. Let's be honest to ourselves. If we have a lot of money, I bet most of us would like to live in a bigger house with a lot of space. Then we will visit these 'smart-growth' areas for leisure purposes in the weekends. Why would anyone like to live there?

 

[Chuck]

Once you've gotten over the hurdle of having a decent down payment and an acceptable credit history for the mortgage, there's really not much of a difference in affordability between entry level houses and typical condos. The type of property you buy is based predominantly on your lifestyle preferences, and finances are secondary.

If you value space over all else, you'll get a 2500 square foot house on the edge of the city and won't mind commuting. If there's a neighbourhood you absolutely have to live in, you'll settle for a condo if that's the only way you can get in. If you can't be bothered to maintain a house, then a condo makes perfect sense. If you feel cramped and need privacy, you'll get a house.

Even within either category, lifestyle drives your purchasing decision. A 1 million dollars house in Rosedale has little in common with a 1 million dollars house in Maple, and yet both exist.

While most people opt for space and therefore purchase homes in the suburbs, the last thing you can do is generalize the entire market that way. NOthing proves that better than the high demand for $400,000 condos in downtown Markham.

 

[yin_yang]

well...they better have free or really cheap parking at this downtown markham or it'll be meh.

 

[edwin]

Whether the parkings will be free or not really depends on how 'downtown' the area can become. Do you find free or cheap parkings in downtown Toronto?

Parking ratio in the whole Markham Centre area (which includes Downtown Markham) is capped at 1.2, which is less than the minimum required in other areas in Markham, which I believe is about 1.25.

People are discouraged to drive in Downtown Markham. As Chuck put it, some people like it, others don't.

 

[sl64]

I am very skeptical about how this anti-sprawl picture is often painted. Let's be honest to ourselves. If we have a lot of money, I bet most of us would like to live in a bigger house with a lot of space. Then we will visit these 'smart-growth' areas for leisure purposes in the weekends. Why would anyone like to live there?

Speak for yourself. I, for one, have no particular desire to live in a house and would much rather have a nice condo. What is inherently better about a house? Having a front and back yard? Having a bit more space? Living in a "quiet" residential community? None of these are particularly appealing to me and I surely can't be the only one who feels that way, judging by house and condo sales figures. I'm sure that some people enjoy having "a lot of space", but I'm also sure that other people don't care about having extra space they don't really need, and would rather, for similar money, spend proportionately more on the space that they actually do need.

To each his own.

 

[edwin]

It is indeed very difficult to prove my thesis in reality, since money is always a problem. I would really like to see the house and condo sales figures if all prices are set to be the same for all types and all sizes of properties.

Of course, I cannot speak for everyone.

BTW, anyone bought a condo in Downtown Markham here? I was in the sales centre yesterday. They are selling the phase III townhouses for $600k.

 

[jgreebnerg76]

Say what you want but all of the stuff Remington has put up in Markham has sold extremely well. There appears to be no shortage of buyers. Only restriction is how fast they can put the buildings up. They own a tremendous amount of land up there and truly have the ability to build a city on their own.

JG

 

[edwin]

Don't get me wrong. I love the concept of 'smart growth'. But I have this feeling that some people are taking advantage of the city's support and jacking up the housing prices.

I am not a real estate expert, that's why I cannot understand why those units can be sold at those high prices. My theory is that the real values of new houses are not reflected until the units go into the resell market. Until then, all prices are being manipulated.

Take the Cathedraltown for example. They have been jacking up the prices since phase I. The prices in phase II were even more ridiculous. But they went very fast. Now phase III has been out for months. At the same time the phase I units are completed, and the flippers are putting up the 'for sale' signs all over the place, asking for cheaper prices than phase III. I went into the sales office a few weeks ago. Phase III just doesn't sell.

I have the impression that most buyers of Downtown Markham are investors. That was why I like to ask if there are any buyers around in this forum.

 

[salvius]

It is indeed very difficult to prove my thesis in reality, since money is always a problem. I would really like to see the house and condo sales figures if all prices are set to be the same for all types and all sizes of properties.

I'm actually fairly certain that your thesis is accurate for the majority of Canadians, but this preference is certainly not global.

 

[sl64]

I am not a real estate expert, that's why I cannot understand why those units can be sold at those high prices. My theory is that the real values of new houses are not reflected until the units go into the resell market. Until then, all prices are being manipulated.

Isn't the real value of a house the most that someone is willing to pay for it, though? It doesn't really matter whether it is investors or residents who are willing to pay -- both are part of the market. Are the intentions of the buyer really at issue here? Someone is willing to pay that much, and as far as the market (and developers) are concerned, that's that. The market will always have its share of investors and speculators, and for all the arguments of condo figures being drastically inflated by all the investors driving prices up, I've never seen any really convincing evidence that investors make up more of the market now than they did before -- or than they do in other cities. It's not so much that prices are being manipulated as it is that this is how the market, investors and all, functions.

 

[edwin]

Isn't the real value of a house the most that someone is willing to pay for it, though?

May be I should call it the 'actual' value, just to avoid confusion.

In a market where houses are actively traded way above their actual values, we call it the 'housing bubble'.

Home owners and long-term investors generally don't want to see a 'housing bubble', but short-term investors are usually ok with it.

For sure, housing markets with different proportions of investors/home owners would behave differently. 'Housing bubble' is more likely to appear in a market where there is a large proportion of investors.

 

[Mike in TO]

MARKHAM, ONTARIO--(CCNMatthews - May 23, 2007) -

The Remington Group Inc. has broken ground on Downtown Markham, the largest mixed-use development in North America. The $3-billion, 243-acre community combines residential, retail and commercial properties, all built to high environmental standards and is designed to reflect the sustainable development needs of the province. Downtown Markham is a 20-year project with a long-term vision of promoting sustainability, encouraging car-free, pedestrian-friendly urban living not previously seen in any North American suburb.

Residential properties in Downtown Markham including the Rouge Bijou Condominium Residences and The Benchmark Town Manors have sold in record time. Today, Downtown Markham's first new commercial property tenant in a LEED-registered building, Honeywell of Canada, joins the groundbreaking ceremony.

Political and commercial leaders participating in the groundbreaking include The Remington Group Chairman and President, Rudolph P. Bratty; Michael Chan, MPP, Markham-Unionville, Minister of Revenue; David Caplan, Minister of Public Infrastructure Renewal; Markham Mayor Frank Scarpitti; and Luis Rodrigues, Vice President, Energy Solutions for Honeywell Building Solutions, Canada.

"The Remington Group was a champion of sustainable development long before it became the fashionable thing to do," said Rudy Bratty, Chairman and CEO, The Remington Group. "Downtown Markham is the realization of our vision for an economically vibrant community that emphasizes public space, alternative energy and reduces sprawl by mixing residential and commercial tenancies. Life in Downtown Markham is one where people can live, work and play within a natural environment."

Inspired by Europe's mixed-use communities, Downtown Markham's vibrant urban centre is built at a human scale that promotes a pedestrian friendly core, with all retail amenities, numerous parks, streams and other green spaces located within easy walking distance. Building designs follow sustainable guidelines, including energy efficient power sources and LEED-registered residential and commercial developments. LEED-certified buildings incorporate environmentally sustainable design, better quality building materials, have reduced operating costs, healthier and more productive occupants and conserve natural resources.

The Remington Group worked with a broad range of government ministries and independent environmental groups to ensure green building policies were properly developed and adhered to. The Remington Group has also entered into an agreement with Markham District Energy system, a highly efficient, low maintenance and environmentally friendly method of heating and cooling buildings and homes.

"Honeywell is proud to be the first commercial tenant in a LEED-registered building in Downtown Markham," said Luis Rodrigues, Vice President, Energy Solutions for Honeywell Building Solutions, Canada. "We are a leader in providing energy-efficient and sustainable solutions to our customers around the world, and moving the Canadian headquarters of one of our business groups to Downtown Markham is a great example of our commitment to the environment and energy conservation."

Already a centre for Motorola's headquarters, and now Honeywell, Downtown Markham will be a magnet for a cosmopolitan knowledge workforce that values access to the arts and culture, shopping, leading schools and numerous natural recreation areas for families. As a concentrated economic cluster, Downtown Markham also eliminates lengthy commutes and increases competitiveness in wages and advancement.

The Town of Markham and Province of Ontario are both working to accommodate urban growth while minimizing sprawl. Downtown Markham's design allows for greater density in an environmentally friendly urban area. The community's 98 hectares (243 acres) will become home to 9,500 residents living in approximately 4000 new condominiums and townhouses. More than 16,000 people will work in approximately 4.2 million square feet of office space in the development. The community also features easy access to public transit, including VIVA Rapid Transit and GO Transit.

About The Remington Group

The Remington Group Inc. is a privately held company that owns and operates land development, building construction, property management, and related businesses.

Led for more than 60 years by brothers Rudolph and Jerry Bratty, they have built thousands of homes throughout the Greater Toronto Area. They have a substantial landbank of zoned and serviced residential sites and continue to acquire prime development lands for future commercial projects.

Their wholly owned income portfolio includes more than three million square feet of well located properties throughout Ontario, including industrial, commercial and retail buildings, as well as an inventory of zoned and serviced land in prime locations.

Today, Remington is recognized as an ethical and dedicated development company by homeowners, tenants, community groups, business partners, and all levels of government and their agencies.