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Rob Ford's Toronto

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Setting aside the scandals for a minute, politically, opponents of the Fords can learn a few things from them about grabbing the attention of the apathetic general public. Pretty much everything they say is short enough to fit in a headline and said in plain english. They have a handful of easy to understand policies, and talk about them in a very consistent way.

Because of this they are able to take credit for things that they didn't do. People who know nothing about politics know they are fighting to keep taxes low, whereas it is hard to say exactly what a person like Soknaki or Stintz represents.

A few recent examples:
- The person who probably deserves the most credit for the Scarborough subway is Karen Stintz but because of Ford's 'subways' mantra he could honestly say it was a victory. The papers reported his reaction and I bet a large percentage of the general public think that it was his work.
- He had pretty much nothing to do with the Ice Storm recovery effort but got most of the credit for it by standing in front of cameras day after day talking about it.
- The relentless low tax mantra allows him to take credit for the subway and blame council for raising taxes. Again, you don't see any of his opponents clarifying that this is a necessary tax increase.
- Rob and Doug recently blamed Karen Stintz for increasing fares while reducing service. It's pretty obvious that this situation was caused by Ford's efforts to keep property tax increases low and shift the costs to user fees including transit fares but you don't see Stintz or Soknaki coming out and making that connection.

Well-informed voters for the most part probably didn't vote for Ford the first time around. Given that the Fords' political positions are often inconsistent and sometimes just plain bad, I don't think their political opponents should by trying to fight them on their own terms ("LRTs LRTs LRTs" probably wouldn't be a good slogan) but I am really disappointed at the way city politics seems to be willing to let the Fords run circles around them.
 
TJ O'Pootertoot said:
I think she's "divisive" in that she is clearly an NDP/lefty with something of a niche base and will have to appeal to the centre to win. She's not divisive in the same antagonistic way Ford is; just in the sense of that she's already got her ground at the other extreme staked out. I haven't even really heard "divisive" so much as the idea that people are sick of Ford but still (allegedly) also enjoying his purported money-saving skills. So, if they can get someone else who will keep taxes low and cutting the budget (allegedly) but not hang out with gangs and do crack, that's the ideal person.

That's not Olivia Chow. She is an entirely different vision and maybe it's a better vision but she's going to have to move to the centre somewhat to win people. In a weird way she's not even running against Ford in that there is no way any Nayshun people would ever vote for her and most of her base would never vote for him (they're most definitely in the 60% we've been seeing in the polls). IMHO, he is incapable of winning anyone over at this point but (putting aside vote splitting etc. for now) she will have to add a lot of people to her existing base to win. Certainly winning over the less-liberal people outside the core will be her key move. John Tory, by contrast, has a much wider base, I think, both geographically and ideologically. Obviously right now he's seen as the Sane Conservative With a Heart, and therefore the best/most likely person to displace Ford.

So, divisive is not the right word for Chow. But it is fair to say she is the opposite of Ford in many respect and that people have strong opinions about her.
Click to expand...

TJ, I really don't mean to pick on you, and there have already been a couple of other replies that cover some of my thinking on Chow, but you just did it again. You are correct that the hard right won't want to vote for Chow, but you then go down the rabbit hole 'lower taxes' immediately. There are a TON of people who don't immediately weigh every candidate on 'lower taxes'. Seriously.

I think that most handicappers of this election are not really taking into account the 'anti-Ford' vote. Unfortunately, I'll not be in Toronto to vote come this fall, but if I was, I would be voting for whomever has the best chance to unseat Ford. That would be my primary voting premise. My secondary premise, if there were two or three candidates ahead of Ford come election time, would be their own policies. Given straw polls and talking to friends, I'd say that the 60% figure (of people who said they'd never vote for Ford) is way, way low. I'm betting EVERYONE, outside the 20% core Ford Nation types who are voting to stick it in the eye of the rest of the city, will vote for someone else, even if that other person's other policies are not 100% lined up with their own.

If he makes it to election day, Ford will get 20% or less of the vote. Someone, be it Chow, Soknacki, Tory, Stintz, or someone else, will win with 50%+ of the vote, as a combination of their policies and the 'best chance of making Ford go away' vote.

At the moment, as a centre-right guy who hates Ford, I'm leaning to Soknacki. But, as I said, my vote won't be there to be counted, sadly.
 
I wonder if Ford has an inkling of the public humiliation he's about to endure once this election business gets going. The dough boy will have so many holes punched in his circumference that the rotundity will collapse unto itself. A flattened Ford, - now that's an image to soothe the mind.
 
She doesn't sip wine with the elites so she is just as normal as you or me, not part of the 1% at all. :rolleyes:
 
pattycakes said:
Here's an example of Doug's "down to earth" "non-elite" wife:

http://instagram.com/p/j2aflgQdRP/
Click to expand...

Yup, and Louis Vuitton bags for her and the girls too. Very difficult to find one of those for less than $1000.

It's like Doug read the syllabus for a marketing course and now thinks he's got targeting nailed. Their only hope is a particular vote segment so ALL OF A SUDDEN, OUT OF THE BLUE, the Fords are un-elite churchgoing scenemakers.

We're on to you, guys.

Please, media. Address this angle?
 
Riverdale Rink Rat said:
TJ, I really don't mean to pick on you, and there have already been a couple of other replies that cover some of my thinking on Chow, but you just did it again. You are correct that the hard right won't want to vote for Chow, but you then go down the rabbit hole 'lower taxes' immediately. There are a TON of people who don't immediately weigh every candidate on 'lower taxes'. Seriously.
Click to expand...

I'm talking more about my perception of the perception, not my actual perception, if you follow.

I think Torontonians have been ridiculously indulged in their concept of what they should be paying in taxes and Ford has pandered to that and thus set the discourse. No one (including Chow) is likely to be brave enough to run on a platform that says, "Look, if we raise taxes 5% a year we can have stunning parks, get the TTC to be a great system without raising fares and otherwise turn this city into what we all want it to be." No one is going to say, "This city has a revenue problem, not a spending problem" to paraphrase a great leader. No one is going to pull up a bar graph that shows how every single 905 municipality charges more in taxes AND had an increase this year at least 2X Toronto's 2.23%.

Is that the crucial issue for everyone? I doubt it. I hope someone has an actual vision for Toronto that goes way beyond that. Certainly there are some people who wouldn't vote for Ford at this point even if Doug dropped off an Escalade in their driveway. But I think the lean/mean discourse has become the starting point, whether it's wise or sane or not. I don't endorse it, it's just my sense of how things are laying out. I hope I'm wrong.
 
https://soundcloud.com/torontostar/doug-ford-scrum/s-tqr7G

After listening to this yesterday, I totally believe this Blaine thing was orchestrated solely to keep the media from Soknacki. Doug was almost nice (except to Daniel Dale who he was incredibly rude to) to the media and seemed to talk a long time just to keep them there. The one woman who kept engaging in conversation with him really annoyed me. I don't understand why any of these media people stick around and talk to him when he's just being a jerk and just repeating all his favourite catch phrases.
 
calimehtar said:
Setting aside the scandals for a minute, politically, opponents of the Fords can learn a few things from them about grabbing the attention of the apathetic general public. Pretty much everything they say is short enough to fit in a headline and said in plain english. They have a handful of easy to understand policies, and talk about them in a very consistent way.

Because of this they are able to take credit for things that they didn't do. People who know nothing about politics know they are fighting to keep taxes low, whereas it is hard to say exactly what a person like Soknaki or Stintz represents.

A few recent examples:
- The person who probably deserves the most credit for the Scarborough subway is Karen Stintz but because of Ford's 'subways' mantra he could honestly say it was a victory. The papers reported his reaction and I bet a large percentage of the general public think that it was his work.
- He had pretty much nothing to do with the Ice Storm recovery effort but got most of the credit for it by standing in front of cameras day after day talking about it.
- The relentless low tax mantra allows him to take credit for the subway and blame council for raising taxes. Again, you don't see any of his opponents clarifying that this is a necessary tax increase.
- Rob and Doug recently blamed Karen Stintz for increasing fares while reducing service. It's pretty obvious that this situation was caused by Ford's efforts to keep property tax increases low and shift the costs to user fees including transit fares but you don't see Stintz or Soknaki coming out and making that connection.

Well-informed voters for the most part probably didn't vote for Ford the first time around. Given that the Fords' political positions are often inconsistent and sometimes just plain bad, I don't think their political opponents should by trying to fight them on their own terms ("LRTs LRTs LRTs" probably wouldn't be a good slogan) but I am really disappointed at the way city politics seems to be willing to let the Fords run circles around them.
Click to expand...

Whatever one might say about the campaign, the Ford's messaging since the election has been a mess even before the crack scandal. There is nothing to be learned from it. While every sensible person in the city is right to think Ford's approval rating should be 0%, the simple fact is that Ford's approval rating has been terrible for a mayor since long before the crack video, and the 40% Forum numbers are themselves highly suspect. I don't understand the concern about trying to appeal to the 20-30% in this city who still want this idiot mayor. Focus on the other 70-80%. This is a city that elected David Miller twice. You don't need to be the lowest common denominator to win.

And I think this is especially true for 2014. Change is important. Think Obama after Bush.
 
Studying Rob Ford

For a group of Master of Journalism students at Ryerson University, going to class meant studying Rob Ford. Their media law and ethics class was centred around the Ford crack scandal and the legal and ethical dilemnas faced by journalists covering that story. Metro Morning's Morgan Passi visited Ryerson to hear what the students learned.
Click to expand...

http://www.cbc.ca/metromorning/episodes/2014/02/13/studying-rob-ford/
 
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