nfitz
Superstar
True - though I don't recall seeing an alignment. Just corridors, similar to shown below.
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ericmacm
Active Member
This is true, the current alignment (as opposed to the study corridor) was created in 2020 after the HWY 413 study was resumed, but I still wouldn’t consider it “out of nowhere”. The narrowing down of the alignment is what should be one of the later steps in the planning process. The only reason that the Bradford Bypass has had the actual alignment planned for so long is because it almost reached the construction phase 2 times - once in 1985 (after which the project was cancelled) and once in 2003 (after which the project was shelved). I wouldn’t consider that the normal process for highway construction, though. These projects shouldn’t normally take 50 years to go from planning to construction.
Our best point of comparison, the HWY 407E project, started undergoing the EA process in the 2000s and was already at the “preferred route” stage in 2007.
nfitz
Superstar
Nor would I.
toaster29
Active Member
nfitz
Superstar
I wouldn't say it came out of nowhere. I would say it came out of virtually nowhere. Obviously a huge chasm between that, as yes the general corridor was studied many years ago. But certainly no actual locations, no public consultation on the properties involved. Have those public consultations been scheduled yet?
More to the point, it was not in the PC's 2022 or 2018 election platform, as far as I know.
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Wm Perkins Bull
Active Member
It was in the 2018 platform, Patrick Brown was PC Leader when it was readded to the platform.
Here is a clip from the 2018 platform
Here is an article from 2017 noting Patrick Brown pledge to complete the EA
nfitz
Superstar
I was referring to the platform during the 2018 under a different leader, after Brown resigned in disgrace.
Was the 413 EA completed? What's the schedule for it? Perhaps I missed that.
Was the 413 EA completed? What's the schedule for it? Perhaps I missed that.
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Wm Perkins Bull
Active Member
The linked PC Party Platform is from after Ford was elected to leader of the Progressive Conservatives. In the 2022 election, Ford reiterated his commitment to building Highway 413
Phase 1 is complete, Phase 2 is still underway.
nfitz
Superstar
Ah, I forgot the timing. The 413 announcement was way back in November 2018 - just after the 2018 election.
And perhaps buried in the party platform developed under Brown - but I'm puzzled where Ford mentioned it during the 2018 election.
Ah - here's the website. I guess I haven't been paying much attention to this project.
innsertnamehere
Superstar
Again, the 413 has been around in study form since the late 2000's. MTO identified a rough corridor for it in 2012, and was proceeding with the EA until the Liberals cut the cord on it under Wynne in 2017. The Conservatives, and indeed the Liberals, had supported the highway before that (in fact, the Liberals were the ones who initiated the project!). The Conservatives decried the cancellation at the time and maintained support for it throughout.
All Ford did was elevate the highway from a relatively local issue in Caledon and Vaughan to a pet project on the provincial level to support his "build roads" type campaign. Pre-2018 most people outside of transportation circles and Caledon and Vaughan had never heard of the project, despite it having been in gestation for many years at that point.
If you want to go even further back, Peel and Halton Regions had actually completed an EA for a north-south municipal expressway on the western route of the 413 to service growth in west Brampton and in Georgetown. The expressway would have run a similar route as the 413 up from the 401/407 to around Mayfield, from what I remember.
All Ford did was elevate the highway from a relatively local issue in Caledon and Vaughan to a pet project on the provincial level to support his "build roads" type campaign. Pre-2018 most people outside of transportation circles and Caledon and Vaughan had never heard of the project, despite it having been in gestation for many years at that point.
If you want to go even further back, Peel and Halton Regions had actually completed an EA for a north-south municipal expressway on the western route of the 413 to service growth in west Brampton and in Georgetown. The expressway would have run a similar route as the 413 up from the 401/407 to around Mayfield, from what I remember.
urbancog
Active Member
The 413 Team released:
www.highway413.ca
www.highway413.ca
There's a claim that Hwy413's impact on GHGs will only be a 0.3% increase in emissions. The assertion is that traffic will only increase by 15% but because the hwy will relieve congestion, the traffic will move more efficiently. I'd be interested in other peoples take on this but it doesn't feel right to me. Also, how many tons of CO2 emission is 0.3% of all GTA traffic?
Highway 413 - Cumulative Effects
Learn how Ontario is taking steps to expand the Greenbelt to protect environmental, groundwater and agricultural resources for future generations.
www.highway413.ca
Highway 413 - Consultation
Highway 413 Ontario plan to consult with local communities, businesses and Indigenous Communities. Learn more...
www.highway413.ca
There's a claim that Hwy413's impact on GHGs will only be a 0.3% increase in emissions. The assertion is that traffic will only increase by 15% but because the hwy will relieve congestion, the traffic will move more efficiently. I'd be interested in other peoples take on this but it doesn't feel right to me. Also, how many tons of CO2 emission is 0.3% of all GTA traffic?
nfitz
Superstar
Traffic moving efficiently on a freeway? That would be a first.
The only way that's true, in the long-term, is if they toll it, and 407-levels. Otherwise people will still be sat stuck in traffic.
0.3% must be tonnes of CO2
The only way that's true, in the long-term, is if they toll it, and 407-levels. Otherwise people will still be sat stuck in traffic.
0.3% must be tonnes of CO2
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innsertnamehere
Superstar
The 413 Team released:
Highway 413 - Cumulative Effects
Learn how Ontario is taking steps to expand the Greenbelt to protect environmental, groundwater and agricultural resources for future generations.Highway 413 - Consultation
Highway 413 Ontario plan to consult with local communities, businesses and Indigenous Communities. Learn more...
There's a claim that Hwy413's impact on GHGs will only be a 0.3% increase in emissions. The assertion is that traffic will only increase by 15% but because the hwy will relieve congestion, the traffic will move more efficiently. I'd be interested in other peoples take on this but it doesn't feel right to me. Also, how many tons of CO2 emission is 0.3% of all GTA traffic?
Moving at free-flow and moving faster than without the freeway are two very, very different things.
Most of the traffic savings from the 413 are expected to be diverted traffic off of arterials roads in Peel and York Regions, where traffic is much slower speed and gets caught at large, long signals. Even if you are traveling at an average of 40km/h on the 413 (a very congested average speed for a freeway), you will still be travelling significantly faster than driving all the way down Mississauga Road to the 401 from Mayfield, for example, or all the way across Major Mackenzie from the 427.
The 413 is not expected to make major differences on congestion levels on existing freeways in the region (albeit small differences), but will offer more direct paths for driver which will create time savings for drivers using the highway itself.
The big travel time savings on existing corridors needs widening of the existing corridors themselves, a la the 401 widening through Mississauga.
nfitz
Superstar
I am, of course, referring to not moving, but having the engine and A/C on, stuck in traffic.
guavadelic
New Member
The delay in construction of various stations seems tied to Ford's insistence on private developers building the stations for them. A government with a different strategy likely would speed things up (hopefully).