PM Justin Trudeau's Canada

[afransen]

I didn't either until I talked to a mortgage agent a few weeks ago. She pointed out that the amount is not insignificant for families with lower incomes and they know that anything that reduces CCB will basically reduce risk (because higher income), so they count it. At a macro level though, this is terrible for housing. All it will do is give families more room to bid up prices.



Don't need any of that. There are already caterers that provide various school lunch services of various kinds. School kitchens like France are actually rather inefficient. Much easier to have larger industrial kitchens and simply deliver food carts to each school. There's a good video from a Canadian who lives in Japan explaining how school lunches work for kids there. It's a high quality, low cost, plant forward, seasonal menu, served family style in class by students, to each other. And it's made in school or centralized kitchens (location dependent) daily. Highly recommend watching this:

Example of a centralized Japanese school lunch kitchen servicing a whole bunch of schools:

Here's an Indian kitchen that feeds 75 000 kids per day:

And this is an example of a Korean megakitchen that produces 10 000 meals for office workers at 7000 won (about CA$7) each:

Japan and Korea are not low wage, low cost countries. What they have in common is that they industrialize the process, focus on seasonal ingredients and limit expensive proteins like meat and cheese. What they produce is not only cheaper, but healthier and tastier. These kitchens also creates high quality employment for cooks and chefs normally working in hard-driven restaurant environments.

Was going to post that LWIF video if you hadn't already. I like that, and having the kids clean the school each day as well. I don't think it would fly culturally here in Canada, as our kids are precious little prince(sse)s, and acts of service are beneath them rather than opportunities to build character.

 

[jje1000]

Who’d thunk?

https://twitter.com/x/status/1775203860442661226

 

[Richard White]

Who’d thunk?

View attachment 553118

https://twitter.com/x/status/1775203860442661226

He is trying to save face in a way that will allow him to curtail immigration levels even further.

 

[Northern Light]

Who’d thunk?

View attachment 553118

https://twitter.com/x/status/1775203860442661226

I listened to the whole statement.

Notable:

1) He states that this 'temporary immigration has gotten out of control' (as if this wasn't the result of government policy choices); but then cites a novel statistic....

He notes than in 2017 Canada's workforce was comprised of 2% TFW/Foreign Students; today that number is 7.5% This is novel, because the numbers we usually here are TFW + Foreign Students are part of the overall population, as opposed to the workforce.

2) He expressly admits this has had the impact of lowering wages in some sectors.

****

Full points for belated honesty; though - points for the omission of owning up to making the choices that caused the problem.

But also omitted was any clear target of what percent the government would consider acceptable on a go-forward basis. To date, the immigration minister has suggested lowering the percentage of the population that is temporary from 6% to 5% over three years.

Far too little, and too slowly to boot.

We need a credible and viable target, I would argue for 4% in 2 years, and back to 2% within 4 years.

 

[tiffer24]

"Axe the tax! Axe the tax!" LOL

Five farm tractors caused a multi-vehicle collision en route to a carbon tax protest site in the Crowsnest Pass on Monday, RCMP said.

In a release sent Tuesday, police said 50 vehicles were at an approved protest site in the Crowsnest Pass but the tractor drivers refused to stop when officers were attempting a traffic check. The Mounties say the investigation into the incident is ongoing.

"This incident serves as a reminder that protesting on a public highway is not safe," the RCMP said in a news release. "We do not take enforcement action lightly, but the safety of motorists, protesters and a traveller's right to use a public highway must be maintained. It is extremely unsafe to stand or impede traffic on a public roadway."

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calg...rm-tractor-collision-crowsnest-pass-1.7161335

 

[Admiral Beez]

I listened to the whole statement.

Notable:

1) He states that this 'temporary immigration has gotten out of control' (as if this wasn't the result of government policy choices); but then cites a novel statistic....

He notes than in 2017 Canada's workforce was comprised of 2% TFW/Foreign Students; today that number is 7.5% This is novel, because the numbers we usually here are TFW + Foreign Students are part of the overall population, as opposed to the workforce.

2) He expressly admits this has had the impact of lowering wages in some sectors.

****

Full points for belated honesty; though - points for the omission of owning up to making the choices that caused the problem.

But also omitted was any clear target of what percent the government would consider acceptable on a go-forward basis. To date, the immigration minister has suggested lowering the percentage of the population that is temporary from 6% to 5% over three years.

Far too little, and too slowly to boot.

We need a credible and viable target, I would argue for 4% in 2 years, and back to 2% within 4 years.

Foreign students should have no path to immigration. If I go to France to get my Masters at INSEAD, for example, at the end of my studies I’m not staying in France, but coming home. My friend went to the Ross University School of Veterinary Medicine in St. Kitt's, not because they wanted to emigrate to St. Kitt’s, but to get an accessible education and then come home to Canada to work. When I was at University in the early 1990s I had many friends who were international students, including several from India studying journalism and engineering, and all of them returned home after graduation. That’s how it’s supposed to work.

 

[kEiThZ]

Foreign students should have no path to immigration. If I go to France to get my Masters at INSEAD, for example, at the end of my studies I’m not staying in France, but coming home. My friend went to the Ross University School of Veterinary Medicine in St. Kitt's, not because they wanted to emigrate to St. Kitt’s, but to get an accessible education and then come home to Canada to work. When I was at University in the early 1990s I had many friends who were international students, including several from India studying journalism and engineering, and all of them returned home after graduation. That’s how it’s supposed to work.

Disagree. Students make the best immigrants. No hassles about foreign qualifications or language. Time to acculturate with others their age. And time to develop a social network essential to succeeding. And we get them at the start of their tax paying careers after another country has born the cost of raising them.

The problem here is our management of the policy. Instead of giving preference to multi-year college programs or graduate degrees in critical areas like healthcare, construction, engineering, manufacturing, IT, etc., we gave work permits to kids completing one year marketing diplomas at career colleges in strip malls. That's our own incompetence.

 

[Admiral Beez]

Disagree. Students make the best immigrants. No hassles about foreign qualifications or language.

No, my family's example are the best immigrants. 1976, I arrive in Canada with my Dad's transfer from JWT UK to JWT Canada, we all spoke English fluently, my Dad immediately began making a middle class income, bought a house and we seamlessly settled into Canadian life. Our sponsor was my uncle, who as an engineer arrived in Canada in 1972 with a job transfer from BP UK to BP Canada (later Petro Canada), who also settled into middle class Canadian life with ease. This was back when Canada was seen as the place for professional, educated and accredited (with accreditations automatically recognized as equivalent to Canadian) people living in first world/developed nations (though Britain was on the ropes in the 1970s) to emigrate to, rather than today where most of our newcomers seem to be low skilled from desperately poor or developing nations.

If Canada can now only appeal to the world's desperate economic migrants and those who are willing to live ten to a house and work in near sweatshop conditions or serving our Timmies and delivering our Doordash lunches, all while driving down the average Canadian's wage negotiating power, then I agree we'd better sweeten the incentives for anyone with an education and future potential through an improved student visa program.

I welcome all to Canada, but I wish we could appeal to the best educated and skilled through affordable housing, equivalency of accreditations and economic opportunities right out of the gate, without having to dangle the student visa incentives.

 

[kEiThZ]

No, my family's example are the best immigrants. 1976, I arrive in Canada with my Dad's transfer from JWT UK to JWT Canada, we all spoke English fluently, my Dad immediately began making a middle class income, bought a house and we seamlessly settled into Canadian life. Our sponsor was my uncle, who as an engineer arrived in Canada in 1972 with a job transfer from BP UK to BP Canada (later Petro Canada), who also settled into middle class Canadian life with ease.

The fact that your family needed a sponsor actually says their application wasn't strong enough to qualify on their own. My parents, by contrast, qualified by themselves, with no relatives in Canada to win them points. The reliance on family is actually a major feature of the American system. And there's real downsides to that. We actually have seen the Liberals increase family reunification, for example by re-instituting PR for parents. This is actually part of the diversion from the traditional merit based system. Personally, I do think the next government should go back to restricting family reunification and rely more on qualified migrants.

This was back when Canada was seen as the place for professional, educated and accredited (with accreditations automatically recognized as equivalent to Canadian) people living in first world/developed nations (though Britain was on the ropes in the 1970s) to emigrate to, rather than today where most of our newcomers seem to be low skilled from desperately poor or developing nations.

You seem to be thinking like Trump when he was wondering why the US couldn't get more Scandinavian immigrants. I think people forget that immigrants only come from places that are struggling and offer less opportunity. Somebody who has a great career and life in Europe, isn't going to leave.

Moreover, only countries that are growing have surplus bodies to spare. This isn't going to be Japan or Europe. Increasingly, this isn't even China. India has a young population bulge and so we get the majority of immigrants from there right now. Their birth rate has declined to replacement though and so in the 2030s, the majority source of immigrants will be Africa.

If Canada can now only appeal to the world's desperate economic migrants, and those who are willing to live ten to a house and work in near sweatshop conditions or serving our Timmies and delivering our Doordash lunches, then I agree we'd better sweeten the incentives for anyone with an education and future potential through an improved student visa program. I welcome all to Canada, but I wish we could appeal to the best educated and skilled through affordable housing, equivalency of accreditations and economic opportunities right out of the gate, without having to dangle the student visa incentives.

Canada can attract the best. Like I said earlier, it's our incompetence that we didn't. The government could have gone out and said we'll only source students in areas we need. Or we'll only give work permits to grad students. They could have gone out and targeted all those skilled immigrants the US takes on strenuous H1B visas and basically let the tech sector bring most of them here. They started to do that. But did too little of that and too late.

Let's be clear, if properly screened and educated, these students are valuable. If you put them into critical areas, you will address critical skills shortages immediately. Something that can take years to address with our native population (for example trying to get our youth interested in science and tech or hands-on work). The government deliberately chose to create a mockery of a system which allowed strip mall college and make-work 1 year diplomas at community colleges to bring in hundreds of thousands of low wage workers under the guise of economically needed immigration. There are still plenty of high skilled immigrants that come to Canada. It's just less obvious now because we take in as many of these faux students. Our incompetence at execution doesn't make the idea poor.

Lastly, the idea that students aren't economically valuable is nuts. But maybe that's just the techie in me. We live in a world where a substantial amount of new businesses are started by undergrad or grad students. That's exactly when we want them here. And attracting the best students and keeping them in the country, is a major part of why the US has been so successful at innovation. Educating them and sending them home to boost somebody else's economy would be nuts. It's no different that Waterloo grads fueling Silicon Valley. Does it really matter if that Waterloo grad is a Canadian or foreign student? Either way, it's a loss for us.

 

[Admiral Beez]

Lastly, the idea that students aren't economically valuable is nuts. But maybe that's just the techie in me. We live in a world where a substantial amount of new businesses are started by undergrad or grad students. That's exactly when we want them here. And attracting the best students and keeping them in the country, is a major part of why the US has been so successful at innovation. Educating them and sending them home to boost somebody else's economy would be nuts. It's no different that Waterloo grads fueling Silicon Valley. Does it really matter if that Waterloo grad is a Canadian or foreign student? Either way, it's a loss for us.

Good point, this. Okay, on the student visas, just make strategical choices that benefit Canadian innovation rather than cheap labour for unskilled work.

 

[kEiThZ]

Good point, this. Okay, on the student visas, just make strategical choices that benefit Canadian innovation rather than cheap labour for unskilled work.

This has been the problem. They abused a really good idea. We could have used the student visas to get some of the best minds in the world, and hopefully retain some of them. But they want to prop up housing and provide the corporate sector with cheap labour, so they turned what was a good idea, into a back door for unskilled labour. It was and is ridiculous.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

This has been the problem. They abused a really good idea. We could have used the student visas to get some of the best minds in the world, and hopefully retain some of them. But they want to prop up housing and provide the corporate sector with cheap labour, so they turned what was a good idea, into a back door for unskilled labour. It was and is ridiculous.

Though that is historical - our immigration system has always been about attracting workers for jobs that are unattractive to locals (think from farmers/settlers to industrial/construction workers and now to service workers). The HQPs are an add on, not a default.

AoD

 

[evandyk]

A lot of the most successful countries in the US were founded by people who moved there to study and stayed. I don’t think it should be automatic, but I think it should be pretty easy. My FIL is a professor who takes on grad students from around the world, and pretty much all of them would enrich Canada by staying. That said, this is not true of any of those fly-by-night career colleges.

 

[lenaitch]

This has been the problem. They abused a really good idea. We could have used the student visas to get some of the best minds in the world, and hopefully retain some of them. But they want to prop up housing and provide the corporate sector with cheap labour, so they turned what was a good idea, into a back door for unskilled labour. It was and is ridiculous.

Including the 'immigration consultants' who have conned the students and gamed the system into a de facto back door immigration path, along with the government and bureaucrats who have allowed it to happen.

 

[kEiThZ]

Including the 'immigration consultants' who have conned the students and gamed the system into a de facto back door immigration path, along with the government and bureaucrats who have allowed it to happen.

This whole industry would not exist if the government did enable it through regulation and a wilful blind eye. People forget, that it's not just strip mall colleges. A whole lot of public colleges built easy 1 yr programs to create a pathway to residency, so that they could make bank off would be immigrants. And as long as everybody was making money off this, the government was looking the other way.