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New University...where should it go?

The Portlands. All vibrant neighbourhoods are built around a campus--the Annex model.

Call it "Lake Ontario University."

ps, prospere gal, you mean to say cool ppl hang out at the golfcourse? Only bores, imo....

I think the portlands is a great idea!! It would remind me of Queen's somewhat. If only I could vote where to put a new campus.
 
That's probably not going to happen. We currently have university and college affiliated programs that are generally applied bachelor's degrees, but we'll might see more combined/concurrent programs where they'd have to take more liberal arts courses.

This is what you'll see more and more of, yes. But I'm not convinced it's the right thing.

My immigrant parents would have freaked out if I went into a trade (and not to mention that many trades aren't exactly "lady-like" and unlike medicine or law, hard to imagine that it could become that way...it's something that matters a lot to some immigrant parents. I think many would find them "ungentlemanly" as well. What would they tell their friends at the golf course??)

That's a pretty outdated way of looking at things. In this day and age, I'd wager that a clever person would be able to achieve higher levels, sooner, than if they were in a (now)traditional career.

The notion that certain jobs aren't 'lady-like' or are 'ungentlemanly' is also fantastically outdated :) Exactly what is lady-like about the vipers nest of Finance? Or neverending circle-jerk of Law?


Re: question about University and age. Well, Ontario students have always been able to go to University after Grade 12 without needing to do OACs - they just have to go to Univ. outside of Ontario.
 
That's a pretty outdated way of looking at things. In this day and age, I'd wager that a clever person would be able to achieve higher levels, sooner, than if they were in a (now)traditional career.

It's not about the money or "higher levels." One could marry an athlete or singer who makes millions of dollars but he/she could *STILL* be shunned by family.

The notion that certain jobs aren't 'lady-like' or are 'ungentlemanly' is also fantastically outdated :) Exactly what is lady-like about the vipers nest of Finance? Or neverending circle-jerk of Law?

Some things can "become" lady-like/gentlemanly. With the exception of medicine or or something lab-related, anything that requires one to get dirty will unlikely become this way.


Re: question about University and age. Well, Ontario students have always been able to go to University after Grade 12 without needing to do OACs - they just have to go to Univ. outside of Ontario.

I don't know about that. Maybe that was the case before Grade 13 officially became "OAC." When I was applying for university in 1997/1998, all out-of-province universities required students to have OAC credits if applying from Ontario (e.g. You only needed FIVE OACs if you were applying to a school in Nova Scotia - I know that because I applied to Dal and to the University of King's College (yeah, I know that King's is affiliated, but it's still a separate app). The number of years one spent in high school, however, didn't matter.
 
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Education should never be about getting a job. That is the big difference between an elite school and a 'no-frills' school. If that were the case, there should be no stigma about leaving school at 16 to work. Especially if you get trained on the job. And especially if you don't use your BA that you do obtain for anything relating to your job.

OAC was useless and a drain on taxpayer dollars. Why were we doing things for 5 years here when the rest of the world did it better in 4 years or less. OAC was like delaying the cutting of the umbilical cord.

As for a university in the Portlands, I would say that would not be a good idea. It is so isolated down there. Who knows when transit will be provided to the area. It would turn into another York. York has been promised a subway for over 30 years.

I think near the Distillery District would be great. There is a lot of open land there and George Brown already has a campus in the area. Or near one of the river valleys. I'm partial to that idea; the university I attended was built in a river valley.
 
My gripe is grade inflation. In my experience, far too many students expect a good grade for little effort. They expect to graduate. My view is that once you are in university, you should earn the right to stay in. One should show some commitment in the process.

Grade inflation isn't the students' fault. This "I deserve an A" business is well-enforced by years of education without consequences in elementary and high school. I have friends who are teachers who rant about this constantly. There is just absolutely NO WAY to fail a student in elementary school anymore. When you get to high school, there are so many 'second chance' sort of situations where kids can earn a whole credit basically just by showing up -- you can graduate without having done very much work at all. It is this "failing is bad for self-esteem, trying is all that matters" stupidness that causes this sense of entitlement. What incentive do we give students to work hard when they can plainly see that even the kid who's been doing nothing all year gets promoted to the next grade?

On the flip side, I went through a pretty brutal undergrad program. At the beginning of first year there were about 200 of us; by the end of second year there were only half that many left. There really was a sense that they were trying to get rid of people who weren't up to snuff. Many times, the unadjusted class average would be a failing mark -- so whoever got an A in the end really did deserve it. But in the years since I graduated, I've heard that they've become less Darwinian about it. It's a pretty traumatic way to be educated, so I'm glad that they're trying to be a *little* more nurturing.
 
I never said that grade inflation was the fault of students alone. But students certainly do play a role in the process. Part of it is due to an expectation to have a university education.

Universities like to have as many students as possible graduate. It plays a role in healthy funding for the institution. Also, lecturers or sessional instructors don't look too good failing students in a manner that is above the average.

Not all courses of study are the same. I would like to see certain programs remain very rigorous in structure. Engineering and medicine are two that come to mind. There are many other good example.
 
It's not about the money or "higher levels." One could marry an athlete or singer who makes millions of dollars but he/she could *STILL* be shunned by family.

I know, that's why I said it was outdated.



Some things can "become" lady-like/gentlemanly. With the exception of medicine or or something lab-related, anything that requires one to get dirty will unlikely become this way.

Oh. Isn't that also an outdated way of looking at things? I thought we'd put the PrettyGirl/DirtyBoy stereotypes away?



I don't know about that. Maybe that was the case before Grade 13 officially became "OAC." When I was applying for university in 1997/1998, all out-of-province universities required students to have OAC credits if applying from Ontario (e.g. You only needed FIVE OACs if you were applying to a school in Nova Scotia - I know that because I applied to Dal and to the University of King's College (yeah, I know that King's is affiliated, but it's still a separate app). The number of years one spent in high school, however, didn't matter.

Well, speaking from experience, it is possible :) Granted, I have a Bachelor of Design, so I suppose your mileage may very depending on your program :)
 
I know, that's why I said it was outdated.

Not as outdated as you think. And anyway, what's wrong with being old-fashioned?





Oh. Isn't that also an outdated way of looking at things? I thought we'd put the PrettyGirl/DirtyBoy stereotypes away?

See above.





Well, speaking from experience, it is possible :) Granted, I have a Bachelor of Design, so I suppose your mileage may very depending on your program :)


Which schools? I started looking at the university application process in Grade 9...yeah, Grade 9 (that would have been 1993-1994). I don't recall any out-of-province schools which accepted fewer than five OACs. This was for a BA, BSc. (including Bsc. Eng, and BSc.N), BFA or B. Com/BBA.
 
Not as outdated as you think. And anyway, what's wrong with being old-fashioned?

What's wrong with an old-fashioned view of jobs, status, and sexual roles? Meh, you're a girl, what do you know?



Which schools? I started looking at the university application process in Grade 9...yeah, Grade 9 (that would have been 1993-1994). I don't recall any out-of-province schools which accepted fewer than five OACs. This was for a BA, BSc. (including Bsc. Eng, and BSc.N), BFA or B. Com/BBA.

I know you aren't trying to call my bluff :) (sooo rude!)

I went to NSCAD from '99 to '03 when I graduated with a BDes (that's a Bachelor of Design)
 
What's wrong with an old-fashioned view of jobs, status, and sexual roles? Meh, you're a girl, what do you know?

LOL! You know, my mother gave me Tiffany's Table Manners for Teenagers when I was 12 years old. This is something I think every tween needs to read (though I'd love it if they updated the book to include a "no texting while dining" rule). The book is still on my shelf and I'll pass it on to my (hypothetical) children when they're around 12. Of course, you're soooooo "modern", and probably think that book's not necessary.


I know you aren't trying to call my bluff :) (sooo rude!)

I went to NSCAD from '99 to '03 when I graduated with a BDes (that's a Bachelor of Design)

I guess design programs have different admissions requirements?
 
The Agenda just had a segment on the Colleges and how they are doing. I will post a link to the video once TVO uploads it, in the meantime here is a blog post from The Agenda blog about college vs. university. I am partial to this because my two overriding observations of post-secondary education is A.) high school guidance councilors never give decent advice and B.)people should take time off from school in between high school and whatever.

I graduated from the University of Guelph in 1995. Although it wasn’t technically a recession, finding a job, any job, was by no means easy. Immediately I discovered that an undergraduate degree in general arts was just not practical. In fact, I soon stopped caring about what job I got and merely wanted to make enough so that I could move out from my parents’ house. I found an ad for a grocery store clerk that paid $10per hour and remember thinking “I can’t even apply to this†because they specified that 5 years experience was mandatory.

It was a frustrating time for me and many of my peers. It was then that I decided to take a crack at the film industry. I figured that in a work climate that competitive I might as well follow my heart. I found work fairly quickly and then even faster decided to make the switch to television. My mid 20s were spent learning my trade and having a lot of fun. However, after a few years I realized that most of the television jobs I was interested in were journalism jobs and again I had a hard time even getting an interview because I didn’t have the “right†experience. So, I went back to school and got a journalism post graduate certificate from Sheridan College. That did the trick and within 6 months of graduation I was a working journalist.

The thing is, I’m not sure how much I learned at college. It was a fun year, but I already had the know-how. What I needed was a foot in the door. University on the other hand allowed me to explore the boundaries of my own intellectual abilities which was both fun and exciting. That being said, it in no way prepared me for “real life†as the guidance councilors insisted it would.

If I had to do it all over again, would I do it the same way? Probably not. I think I’ll recommend that my kids take a year off after high school to work and travel and figure out what they might want to do with their own lives. I’ve found that easier to do when you’re not in school.
 
Personally I'm 26 now and I have my BSc and I still have no idea what I want to do with my life. Maybe that speaks to my lack of "maturity", but I really have no idea how people find out what they want to do with their lives.
 
Personally I'm 26 now and I have my BSc and I still have no idea what I want to do with my life. Maybe that speaks to my lack of "maturity", but I really have no idea how people find out what they want to do with their lives.

Well you're clearly interested in the general ideas behind this forum so why not use that as a starting point ;)

Don't want to get too far off topic but:

I'm afraid most people have no idea what they want to do, and those that say they do usually have a niche in some medium/high paying job sector that they're good at but not necessarily love.

I think the key is not to be afraid of trying something new and going down a path that's probably pretty hard to see far down.
 
Booyeah!

ELIZABETH CHURCH

From Friday's Globe and Mail

March 6, 2009 at 1:50 AM EST

TORONTO — Three Ontario universities – Ryerson, Waterloo and the University of Toronto – are in talks to create a new graduate school of digital media in downtown Toronto, aimed at linking top-flight students with businesses struggling to adapt to emerging technology.

Ohh, doesn't it seem weird that OCAD isn't in on this? Isn't design and media their whole thing?

The joint venture, unveiled yesterday by Ryerson President Sheldon Levy, could be running in less than two years, he said. The leaders of the three schools have already discussed the initiative with the province, and have taken the idea to businesses, including banks and technology firms.

The idea, Mr. Levy said, is to create a centre where industry can bring their most challenging problems in this field and where graduate students can gain real experience. Such collaboration, he said, would make Toronto a centre where the very best students will want to work.

The three universities, he said, have strengths in this area that will complement each other. Ken Coates, dean of the faculty of arts at the University of Waterloo said there is an urgent need to advance the project because of the growing importance of digital media in the province and the country, and that urgency is what prompted the three schools to work together. While it might take years to get a physical home for a new graduate school, he said the universities are already collaborating.Mr. Levy said the proposed centre would tackle problems in areas such as banking, business, media and medicine.

We talk about "European" this and that quite a lot, and this is one area I've always felt the euros do have the right idea. Creating specialized schools that don't try to teach everything to everyone, focusing on a few things in which they know.
 
We talk about "European" this and that quite a lot, and this is one area I've always felt the euros do have the right idea. Creating specialized schools that don't try to teach everything to everyone, focusing on a few things in which they know.

Kinda like Ryerson? I always like that about my alma mater.
 

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