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Monorail for Toronto

SlickFranky said:
BTW, you've referred to people as "manderines" several times here before....what are you trying to say? 'Cuz unless you're calling TTC exec's Chinese I really have no clue what you're going for there.
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In modern English, mandarin is also used to refer to any (though usually a senior) civil servant, often in a satirical context,[12] and particularly in the United Kingdom and Commonwealth countries.
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.
 
ssiguy2 said:
I thought we had grown up and moved beyond the Simpson's song?

No boys, listen clearly......................I am VERY much against such a ridiculous monorail line. Why?..........good god let me count the ways.
First, monorail for an urban setting should rapid and this won't be as it has far too many stations.
Second, the first section from Union to the DVP is fine but after that it is a ridiculous little meandering one-way route.
Third, it's going to cost a small fortune with that many stations. There are stations every two blocks and they must grade separated. Monorail, like subways and SkyTrain is a grade separated transportation system. Iy can run at grade but must have 100% separation as you cannot drive over monorail tracks.

This is the most ridiculous, ill thought out, expensive, and slowest proposal Ford could have come up with. This is not only a ineffectual transit line but is going to end up being a bloody expensive one. The only redeeming point is that with that number of stations the cost per km will be so obscenly high that no one in their right mind would invest in it.
If it were to be a direct line from Union thru the Portland to Ashbridge with 3 fewer stations thru the Portland section itself it could work very well. This would also allow for an interlining {although thhat's a four letter word with the manderines at the TTC} for a DRL with it verging north after the DVP using the existing GO rail ROW.
A childish, mickey-mouse, tonka-toy proposal which should be resisted with vigour unless it does generally the route I describe. Like I said thou, this will be so incredibly expensive it will never get built with any private investment.
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I think that is the point - the Fords propose some cockamamie scheme, the whole plan falls apart because of unrealistic funding and expectations, then they sell the land to a private developer buddy of theirs.
 
EMP1729 said:
I think that is the point - the Fords propose some cockamamie scheme, the whole plan falls apart because of unrealistic funding and expectations, then they sell the land to a private developer buddy of theirs.
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Ah, you've failed to mention the expensive car or vacation they then take ... cash.

I'm joking of course ... being millionaires, the Ford's probably aren't taking bribes ...
 
Again - it's been clarified that they're not talking about a genuine monorail. It's just shorthand for elevated rail, so it could be any number of technologies and should be something that ties in with other technologies being used locally.

I spent some more time looking at all the renders on Matt's website and have to say, the Cherry Tree thing is growing on me. When they're in full bloom it would be quite something. It will provide a lot of eating for birds, but become a bit of a maintenance concern at the end of the the season. It's not crab apple bad, but there is a clean up required.

I guess we have to wait and see how the politics of the thing play out in council over the coming weeks.
 
Marko said:
It will provide a lot of eating for birds, but become a bit of a maintenance concern at the end of the the season. It's not crab apple bad, but there is a clean up required.
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How does that differ from many of our other trees. I was standing beside the streetcar stop when the sweeper went past this morning, and the number of acorns that were being swept up - and tossed aside, was quite surprising.
 
nfitz said:
How does that differ from many of our other trees. I was standing beside the streetcar stop when the sweeper went past this morning, and the number of acorns that were being swept up - and tossed aside, was quite surprising.
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Most city trees don't create fallen fruit, which get squished on the sidewalk or start to rot if not cleaned up.
 
Marko said:
Again - it's been clarified that they're not talking about a genuine monorail. It's just shorthand for elevated rail, so it could be any number of technologies and should be something that ties in with other technologies being used locally.
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It's not anything, Marko. It's just part of a fantasy render with no justification/believability. To say 'it could be an L' or 'it could be a ski lift' would have the same thing -- the assistants are just trying to get Doug off the hook a little as the world lights up his ass.

Marko said:
I spent some more time looking at all the renders on Matt's website and have to say, the Cherry Tree thing is growing on me. When they're in full bloom it would be quite something. It will provide a lot of eating for birds, but become a bit of a maintenance concern at the end of the the season. It's not crab apple bad, but there is a clean up required.
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The cherry trees in DC (I believe) are fruitless. We just put a flowering cherry in the backyard that doesn't bear fruit. They're a beautiful canopy tree. It would be a nice touch.

Marko said:
I guess we have to wait and see how the politics of the thing play out in council over the coming weeks.
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It's kind of cool that you can keep your head while all those around you are losing theirs... but, frankly this is one of those times where there's very little middle ground. Ford is doing something heinous this time -- it's not just Jarvis bike lane wanking (tedious but relatively painless), this is screwing up Toronto on a GRAND scale.
 
To be fair, these trees are of the same genus.

Japanese Cherry Blossom Tree (Sakura): Prunus serrulata
Sweet Cherry Tree (commonly harvested): Prunus avium
Sour Cherry Tree: Prunus cerasus

Toronto does not need a Canada's Wonderland + Vaughan Mills combination by the waterfront (a monorail will look tacky, no matter how it is designed, unless it is constructed as part of the DRL). Maglev monorail is too expensive, especially given that the line will not be long enough to recoup its costs. Canada's Wonderland and Vaughan Mills both belong in suburbia (and rightfully so, one kilometre apart in Vaughan). Yes, I enjoy going to Canada's Wonderland and Vaughan Mills, but public space is more important for Toronto.

The Simpsons nailed the problem with monorails. Though it is an animated sitcom, it presents a convincing critique of modern suburban life. Yes, Marge is right all along. Main Street in Springfield does need repairs (and so do many major arterial roads in Toronto).
 
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Stop spacing can be a very dynamic thing to figure out. What is appropriate for one design may not make sense elsewhere. The lightest stop spacing along this line is about 500 meters average, which is about the average of most Transit City lines. But we are comparing apples to oranges. Transit City was pushed as a rapid transit system designed to cross suburban sprawl in a timely manner. This is being pushed as a means to connect downtown Toronto to a near by high density urban development.

Don't forget when the Yonge line first opened, much of its stop spacing was between 400-600 meters.
 
True but the number of stops is far too high especially when you consider that several of the stations will be "one-way" circular stops. Complete waste of precious transit funds.
 
ssiguy2 said:
True but the number of stops is far too high especially when you consider that several of the stations will be "one-way" circular stops. Complete waste of precious transit funds.
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Is it supposed to be a circulator? I figure it would be branch based. If it is a circulator, then I totally agree with you. If it is a branch, then they could just consolidate some of the upper line's stops to better its performance.

Of course, this assumes this vision goes anywhere at all.
 
Electrify said:
Is it supposed to be a circulator? I figure it would be branch based. If it is a circulator, then I totally agree with you. If it is a branch, then they could just consolidate some of the upper line's stops to better its performance.

Of course, this assumes this vision goes anywhere at all.
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I don't think anyone should hold their breath it actually gets done, but it appears to me that it's not simply a circulator. It goes east from Union, down Cherry and then takes a route that encircles the portlands area before going back up Cherry and returning west to Union (or beyond). It does appear that there's one or two too many stops, but if it's reduced to just 2 or 3 in total then it won't serve the area very well - in which case what's the point?
 
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