Metrolinx: Presto Fare Card

[SlickFranky]

Man, you can be so frustrating sometimes!

The blind are covered. They have free service through CNIB. You were advocating for the not-quite-legally-blind, but partially-visually-impaired. I'm advocating for time-travelers from pre-arabic numeral societies. I made fun of you. Get over it.

 

[nfitz]

The blind are covered. They have free service through CNIB. You were advocating for the not-quite-legally-blind, but partially-visually-impaired. I'm advocating for time-travelers from pre-arabic numeral societies. I made fun of you. Get over it.

Even the blind aren't covered, as they still have to pay on many, if not most of the sytems covered by PRESTO.

Personally, I find making fun of services for the disabled appallingly distasteful.

 

[Tuscani01]

Even the blind aren't covered, as they still have to pay on many, if not most of the sytems covered by PRESTO.

Personally, I find making fun of services for the disabled appallingly distasteful.

He wasn't making fun of anyone but you back there...

Still have to pay on most of the systems?

They are covered on:
Oakville Transit
Mississauga Transit
Hamilton Street Railway (HSR)
Brampton Transit
Toronto Transit Commission (TTC)
Durham Regional Transit
GO Transit
York Region Transit (YRT)
AND
OC Transpo

That is every single system that will be, or is covered by Presto.

Now what?

 

[nfitz]

He wasn't making fun of anyone but you back there...

Still have to pay on most of the systems?

They are covered on:
Oakville Transit
Mississauga Transit
Hamilton Street Railway (HSR)
Brampton Transit
Toronto Transit Commission (TTC)
Durham Regional Transit
GO Transit
York Region Transit (YRT)
AND
OC Transpo

That every single system that will be, or is covered by Presto.

Now what?

Earlier in the thread someone said that they paid a reduced fare on GO. You are saying differently. Who is correct.

 

[Tuscani01]

Earlier in the thread someone said that they paid a reduced fare on GO. You are saying differently. Who is correct.

Got it from the DRT website:

"CNIB customers with a current, registered CNIB card ride conventional DRT and GO Bus free of charge in Durham Region. The CNIB free fare does not apply to Specialized Services. Attendants pay full fare on conventional and Specialized Services. "

http://www.durhamregiontransit.com/durham/index_e.aspx?ArticleID=80

Apparently it is only available in Durham Region, due to a partnership between GO and DRT. Elsewhere it is full fare, but you can bring a guide with you for free.

So still not many, or most of the transit systems you said would not allow it.

 

[Jonny5]

On another note, I have sent reply to my feedback from PRESTO about the 2 hour "tap on to tap on" transfer rule. They don't accept feedback by email, only through the form on their site. It has a limit on the number of characters you can submit, which I did not find sufficient.

I made the following points/questions:

1) From what system does the 2 hour transfer limit originate? I could not find documentation from Burlington Transit or GO Transit or PRESTO which stated that. Single ride GO tickets explicitly state they can be used for 4 hours.
2) GO trips themselves can take more than 2 hours. Oshawa to Aldershot is 2 hours 10 minutes on the train. To continue to Hamilton on the GO bus PRESTO would charge you another $4.20 GO minimum fare. To continue on Burlington Transit would cost a full fare instead of a co-fare.
3) What about late trips. I was over the transfer limit by 7 minutes, but my bus arrived 15 minutes late. If this was a GO trip, would I have to pay the extra $4.20?
4) Even if they continue to enforce this 2 hour rule, it is not published and will impact a much greater number of trips as the system grows. Nowhere are people instructed not to tap on until the moment you board the train.

They better sort this out soon. I am probably one of the first to have this problem, but in time this will be a serious issue. They are supposed to respond to me by next Wednesday.

 

[nfitz]

So still not many, or most of the transit systems you said would not allow it.

Fair enough, however the biggest transit agency that is going to Presto - GO - doesn't allow it. Between that and the fact that free fares are only for the legally blind, and not the almost blind, I'd say that those who fighting this seem to have a very good case.

 

[Jonny5]

Is there an actual law as to who is "legally blind"? I assume it is in the ODA.
If so, GO should just adopt the free pass program like every other agency and the "almost legally blind" need to get on the governments case to have the definition of legal blindness expanded and the ODA improved.

 

[SlickFranky]

Fair enough, however the biggest transit agency that is going to Presto - GO - doesn't allow it. Between that and the fact that free fares are only for the legally blind, and not the almost blind, I'd say that those who fighting this seem to have a very good case.

The vast majority of the 'legally blind' fall into the almost-blind, visually-impaired categorization. If your vision is so poor that (even with corrective lenses) you're still unable to read the displays, there's a good chance you are in fact legally blind.

 

[SGHA504]

It does seem asinine though, that they designed a new system, that doesn't have a speaker that would simply give a vocal version of the display screen for those who are visually impaired (which could presumably be marked on each card, so that the sound doesn't go off for every user).

I'd have thought the expense of doing this, would be far less than retrofitting the GPS and announcement system on 2,000 TTC vehicles, that was done a few years ago.

Anyone designing such a scheme would have been aware of the court rulings on the stop announcements, and this was inevitable.

Obviously, they won't be turning off Presto while they fix this, but presumably they will have to fix this before they roll out to TTC.

Wouldn't it then become a privacy and security issue? Lets say a blind passenger uses his or her card and it triggers an audio announcement to the effect of "YOU HAVE 320 DOLLARS LEFT ON YOUR ACCOUNT". I'm no expert here but, regardless of disability it doesnt seem like that type of solution would fly based on putting the person with the account announcement at risk. Audio jack maybe?

 

[W. K. Lis]

Wouldn't it then become a privacy and security issue? Lets say a blind passenger uses his or her card and it triggers an audio announcement to the effect of "YOU HAVE 320 DOLLARS LEFT ON YOUR ACCOUNT". I'm no expert here but, regardless of disability it doesnt seem like that type of solution would fly based on putting the person with the account announcement at risk. Audio jack maybe?

Maybe a bluetooth device tuned to pick up a preset and paired frequency of the announcement from the touchpad and card within close range. All three items must be in close range to get the announcement.

 

[nfitz]

Wouldn't it then become a privacy and security issue? Lets say a blind passenger uses his or her card and it triggers an audio announcement to the effect of "YOU HAVE 320 DOLLARS LEFT ON YOUR ACCOUNT". I'm no expert here but, regardless of disability it doesnt seem like that type of solution would fly based on putting the person with the account announcement at risk. Audio jack maybe?

How so? anyone who stands at the entrance can easily see the balance of those in front of them right now.

 

[EnviroTO]

The reality is that accessibility shouldn't be an afterthought... especially for government projects. Most large companies don't allow software to be installed without it being accessible to screen readers and those of limited sight so how can Presto have missed out on the requirement? Those screens aren't even accessible to people with limited sight due the poor contrast and small size.

 

[nfitz]

Heck, I've got perfect sight, and I find it tough to read them. Last time I used the fare checking machine, I had to do it 3 times, before I could understand what it was saying about my balance and default trip.

 

[ShonTron]

I spotted the Presto readers on Mississauga and Brampton buses today. It seems that only some buses are fitted with the machines so far. There's two components: the tap readers at the front door for customers to use, and a display/status machine for the driver, fitted next to the current GFI coin/ticket machines the suburban systems use.