Metrolinx: Presto Fare Card

[Zach6668]

The City has just published "briefing notes' on PRESTO inspectors:

• Inspection rate with current staff = 3.2 % (243K inspections/7,480K riders/month)
• Inspection rate with proposed staffing = 4.6 % (343K inspections/7,480K riders/month)
• Lack of proper enforcement of our fare policies will lead to the growth of fare evasion and the resulting risk to revenue. - 2 - BN# 41 – Jan 18
• The addition of the 20 Fare Inspection positions will reduce the risk to the proper collection of fares.
• Each 1% increment of non-pass fares represents approximately 2.2 million rides which approaches $6 million in lost revenue.
• Industry Standard for Fare Inspection – 4-5% of ridership should be inspected, balancing customer perception of harassment and due diligence.
See: http://www.toronto.ca/legdocs/mmis/2016/bu/bgrd/backgroundfile-87865.pdf

So this makes for an easy expected value calculation.

3.2% = 1 in 31.25 chance at being inspected
At $3.25 fares, the penalty for being caught without POP would need to be at least $101.56 for the transit agency to expect to "break even" on POP - That is, fare evasion losses = fine revenue.

At "industry standard" $4 or $5, it would need to be $81.25 and $65.00 respectively.

I would imagine the fine is higher than all of those, but I have no clue what the penalty actually is.

You always see these reports talking about lost fares, but you never see the associated fine revenue. If you set the numbers right, and inspect the correct proportion of riders, you can set yourself up for net gains.

 

[PinkLucy]

Last I saw it's a $425 fine for fare evasion.

 

[nfitz]

Looking at my own Presto card (which I've loaned to someone today), here's an example of two 506 trips within 55 minutes. The first is westbound to Coxwell, and the second is eastbound for Coxwell.

No more free transfers!

So how are short-turns working? (edit - Brad Ross says don't tap, and take a transfer instead).

 

[Zach6668]

Last I saw it's a $425 fine for fare evasion.

Yeah, I thought it was something like that.

That should help make up for the cost of fare evasion officers, which I neglected in my post above. Though, those costs can be recouped too by not needing staff collecting fares at various other points in the system (which will come along when Presto is fully adopted).

 

[Filip]

That would be the same as in London.. I got into an argument with a bus driver when the bus to Paddington station was short turned and I had to get onto another one and retap my Oyster card. That was basically double dipping as their logic doesn't allow for transfers...

 

[Zach6668]

Looking at my own Presto card (which I've loaned to someone today), here's an example of two 506 trips within 55 minutes. The first is westbound to Coxwell, and the second is eastbound for Coxwell.

No more free transfers!

So how are short-turns working?

View attachment 64330

If you were short turned, and you're just getting on the next streetcar on the same route, wouldn't you just not tap? Would the fare shown on your Presto card not be valid any more? Or does the original tap indicate which vehicle it is on?

 

[nfitz]

If you were short turned, and you're just getting on the next streetcar on the same route, wouldn't you just not tap? Would the fare shown on your Presto card not be valid any more? Or does the original tap indicate which vehicle it is on?

I think the original tap relates to which machine it was tapped on - which is related to vehicle; whether or not the fare checker is that sophisticated I don't know.

However, the fare inspectors have been standing near the back door, and know if you've tapped or not - not bothering to check those who they see tap.

BradTTC has said that if short-turned, not to tap, but to take a transfer instead. Which is fine until they fully implement Presto.

Ultimately, no one will have transfers or passes, and everyone will have to tap to enter. So not tapping will raise suspicion.

 

[Crimson Alchemist]

Not sure if its been answered already, but when do you think Jane Station will get Presto Card readers?

 

[nfitz]

Not sure if its been answered already, but when do you think Jane Station will get Presto Card readers?

I'd guess fourth quarter 2016. They should all be done by Christmas, but all the future installations will get new faregates, so that's all on hold until they test the new faregates - at Main Station, which should happen before Spring. Other than Main, there's been no indication of what the roll-out order will be.

 

[Jonny5]

Took a TTC trip on th 504 today and it is showing in my transaction history only 30 minutes later.

 

[W. K. Lis]

Not sure if its been answered already, but when do you think Jane Station will get Presto Card readers?

Probably, 35 Jane and 195 Jane Rocket would have to get Presto first.

 

[nfitz]

Probably, 35 Jane and 195 Jane Rocket would have to get Presto first.

There's no prerequisite - they added Wellesley station in the last batch, and none of it's routes have Presto.

 

[DSC]

There's no prerequisite - they added Wellesley station in the last batch, and none of it's routes have Presto.

Some subway stations have enough power in the right location so adding Presto machines is not complicated; others need new electrical work. This from latest CEO Report: "Field studies to determine whether sufficient power is available at TTC subway stations to support PRESTO equipment are now complete. The design of the required electrical upgrades at subway stations are now complete at 57 subway stations and the electrical construction work to upgrade the power configuration have been completed at 37 stations." By the end of 2015 there were Presto machines at 23 of the 26 stations in Phase 1. The Report does not list the other 11 stations that now have enough power (37-26) but I assume they will be next on the list - once the new fare gates are tested out.

 

[nfitz]

By the end of 2015 there were Presto machines at 23 of the 26 stations in Phase 1. The Report does not list the other 11 stations that now have enough power (37-26) but I assume they will be next on the list - once the new fare gates are tested out.

There were Presto machines at all 26 of the stations back in July. The 23 of 26 refers to the reload machines, not the Presto entrance to the stations.

Yes, I'd expect those 11 would be next up; probably the ones where you can see that they are working in the stations. Sherbourne comes to mind.

 

[rbt]

So how are short-turns working? (edit - Brad Ross says don't tap, and take a transfer instead).

GO uses the same process for broken vehicles (they don't short-turn that I've experienced). Tap out of current vehicle, and DO NOT tap in/out of new vehicle.