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Metrolinx: Presto Fare Card

OCCheetos said:
Yes, that's it.

They're programmed to work with our fare gates, but not our presto readers for some reason.
Click to expand...

Ottawa's single-use and limited-use media, such as transfers and day passes, are not contactless/RFID. They are just printed QR codes on paper, and every fare gate has a 2D scanner to validate them. On a bus, they are visually inspected. This system works well for Ottawa, as the buses were already equipped with digital transfer printers, so no hardware modifications were required. Ottawa also avoids having to pay any fees to PRESTO for limited use media.

Similarly, Ottawa post-secondary U-Passes are not Presto cards, but rather STO Multi cards which can be validated using the PRESTO equipment. Cheaper than going with Metrolinx.
 
Catenary said:
Ottawa's single-use and limited-use media, such as transfers and day passes, are not contactless/RFID. They are just printed QR codes on paper, and every fare gate has a 2D scanner to validate them. On a bus, they are visually inspected. This system works well for Ottawa, as the buses were already equipped with digital transfer printers, so no hardware modifications were required. Ottawa also avoids having to pay any fees to PRESTO for limited use media.

Similarly, Ottawa post-secondary U-Passes are not Presto cards, but rather STO Multi cards which can be validated using the PRESTO equipment. Cheaper than going with Metrolinx.
Click to expand...

This was a picture posted on the CPTDB of one of the limited-use fares.

20180712_205317.jpg.40db0a405f5710d859548ace442ec8b7.jpg


I know the regular transfers have QR codes on them, but it doesn't seem to be the case for the multi-day passes.
 
Without having to go back 500 pages...…….if I were to take the TTC 70 times a month I would obviously get a Metropass to save money over buying individual or larger book tickets. Seeing the Metropass is $146, if I used Presto for those 70 trips, would it stop charging for any further trips after I hit the total of $146?
 
Catenary said:
Ottawa's single-use and limited-use media, such as transfers and day passes, are not contactless/RFID. They are just printed QR codes on paper, and every fare gate has a 2D scanner to validate them. On a bus, they are visually inspected. This system works well for Ottawa, as the buses were already equipped with digital transfer printers, so no hardware modifications were required. Ottawa also avoids having to pay any fees to PRESTO for limited use media.

Similarly, Ottawa post-secondary U-Passes are not Presto cards, but rather STO Multi cards which can be validated using the PRESTO equipment. Cheaper than going with Metrolinx.
Click to expand...
I'm not a fan of two separate systems. A fare system like the STM is very confusing to tourists. Single use fares aren't contactless, instead it must be inserted to read the magnetic strip. People will try to tap them on readers.
 
ssiguy2 said:
Without having to go back 500 pages...…….if I were to take the TTC 70 times a month I would obviously get a Metropass to save money over buying individual or larger book tickets. Seeing the Metropass is $146, if I used Presto for those 70 trips, would it stop charging for any further trips after I hit the total of $146?
Click to expand...
What you describe is monthly rate capping.

There are plans (soon) for daily rate capping, and even weekly rate capping. But not monthly rate capping. You'd have to pre-purchase a $146 monthly pass. Or a $134 monthly subscription (minimum 12-month term).

According to the June 2018 update to the TTC board, daily rate capping (called Daily Max) starts in about 4 weeks on October 15, 2018, while weekly (Weekly Max) starts in March 2019 "subject to Board approval".

I'm guessing Daily Max is on schedule, with the recent Presto announcement that "The PRESTO website will be unavailable from approximately 10:00 p.m. on Friday, October 12 to late in the evening on Sunday, October 14 for a system upgrade".
 
nfitz said:
What you describe is monthly rate capping.

There are plans (soon) for daily rate capping, and even weekly rate capping. But not monthly rate capping. You'd have to pre-purchase a $146 monthly pass. Or a $134 monthly subscription (minimum 12-month term).

According to the June 2018 update to the TTC board, daily rate capping (called Daily Max) starts in about 4 weeks on October 15, 2018, while weekly (Weekly Max) starts in March 2019 "subject to Board approval".

I'm guessing Daily Max is on schedule, with the recent Presto announcement that "The PRESTO website will be unavailable from approximately 10:00 p.m. on Friday, October 12 to late in the evening on Sunday, October 14 for a system upgrade".
Click to expand...
This is correct....but I think it is worth pointing out the lack of monthly rate cap is not a Presto limitation it is a TTC decision...GO, for example, has monthly capping using Presto....because when Presto came out they ditched their old monthly passes.
 
Steve X said:
I'm not a fan of two separate systems. A fare system like the STM is very confusing to tourists. Single use fares aren't contactless, instead it must be inserted to read the magnetic strip. People will try to tap them on readers.
Click to expand...

Lol, I bought a 3-day STM pass and couldn't figure out why it didn't work in the suck-it-in-spit-it-out reader. It was flimsy cardboard like the single ride ticket I'd got the night before, but apparently had to be tapped... I felt very lucky that the rollers hadn't damaged its chip!
 
TOareaFan said:
This is correct....but I think it is worth pointing out the lack of monthly rate cap is not a Presto limitation it is a TTC decision...GO, for example, has monthly capping using Presto....because when Presto came out they ditched their old monthly passes.
Click to expand...
It's possible, but GO doesn't have weekly capping, daily capping, or monthly passes. I don't know what the technical limitations are, and how many simultaneous time-periods can be capped at once. I thought it was one, and they are working on expanding it to two, to have both daily and weekly capping for TTC. Does anyone else have two now - let alone three?

Looking at all the other agency descriptions at https://www.prestocard.ca/en/about/paying-for-transit I only see the monthly scheme for GO, and weekly capping for both Mississauga and Hamilton.

Gosh, I don't even see daily for Ottawa - I thought they had some kind of daily limit!

KevinT said:
Lol, I bought a 3-day STM pass and couldn't figure out why it didn't work in the suck-it-in-spit-it-out reader. It was flimsy cardboard like the single ride ticket I'd got the night before, but apparently had to be tapped... I felt very lucky that the rollers hadn't damaged its chip!
Click to expand...
I did the similar with an STM one trip ticket ... couldn't figure out why I couldn't tap it! And I spent years commuting in Montreal in a past life! Didn't even know how to get into the Metro anymore ...
 
Metrolinx says it will change rules to allow kids to get Presto cards for free

From link.

Parents had raised concerns that kids needing Presto cards to ride TTC had to pay $16 for the card
​
A spokesperson with Metrolinx says it will work with TTC to change rules to allow kids to get Presto cards without needing to pay for them.
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The TTC was encouraging parents to get Presto cards for their children for easier access to subways. But the transit agency faced criticism from parents who said the rules around purchasing Presto cards forced them to pay the $6 fee for the card and a minimum pre-load of $10.

Children between ages six and 12 can currently hop on and off for free without the card, according to the transit agency.
Click to expand...

The move to get everyone to use Presto cards aims to prepare riders for the elimination of fare collectors in TTC stations by mid-2019, said spokesperson Heather Brown. The aisles will be "barricaded off," forcing children to enter stations using the Presto machines, she told CBC Toronto.

The TTC is delaying the conversion to Presto to wait for a single-use ticket option.

"We need kids to be able to tap themselves through the fare gate and enter the station that way," Brown said.

The program, first launched in 2015, allows children 12 and under to ride the TTC for free.

Parents looking to convert to the digital fare collection system will need to visit a customer service representative at a Shopper's Drug Mart or the TTC service centre at Davisville Station. They need to bring government-issued identification to have the appropriate fare type automatically adjusted on their Presto cards.

"It doesn't deduct any funds," said Brown.

TTC to be fully converted to Presto by 2020

The TTC plans to be "fully" converted to the Presto payment system by Jan. 1, 2020, Brown told CBC Toronto.

In preparation for the phase-out of tokens and paper tickets, she added, "now is the time to get a Presto card for anyone who is on our system."

Presto machines are now installed on buses, streetcars and at every subway station.

Monthly Metropasses will no longer be offered starting in January. Meanwhile, legacy paper tickets and tokens will stop being sold in August 2019, Brown noted.

"It's just about making it easier for people to get into the station," she said.

Last month, the transit agency introduced two-hour transfers, allowing Presto card users to make as many trips as they want in a two-hour window on a single fare.

The discount, applied to an individual's Presto card, is only on TTC fares. UP express is free for kids and GO Transit has a children's fare for kids between 1 and 5.

August also saw the introduction of youth, post-secondary and senior 12-month passes on Presto. Adult 12-month Presto passes were introduced in late May.
Click to expand...
 
I got this response from PRESTO about the confusion for novice users due to different machines for GO and UPX.

Thank you very much for taking the time to raise your concerns – we always appreciate our customer’s feedback.

There are ongoing discussions on how to improve the customer experience for customers using PRESTO on GO Transit or UP Express, including simple and clear signage, increasing the visibility of GO and UP devices, and examining the location of devices to ensure customers are guided to tap on the device associated with the service. As part of these discussions, we will take your feedback and consider your recommendations as we make improvements.

To provide you with some background, the reason for the two different devices is that each one (UP Express and GO Transit) are set up as a separate transit agency with their own distinct fare rules. PRESTO simply enables these two distinct fare rules just as we do for all of the other participating transit agencies across the region.

Due to the fact that GO Transit runs a parallel service along the same tracks (Kitchener line), which also has stops at Union, Weston and Bloor, if you tap on at any one of these stations, PRESTO cannot determine which service (GO Transit or UP Express) a person is using and for how many stations until you tap off, or have set up a default trip and are using a GO Transit device. Having said that, as there is only one type of device at Pearson Airport (UP Express), if you tap on and don’t tap off, the system will recognize and default to the Pearson-Union trip.
 
DSC said:
Due to the fact that GO Transit runs a parallel service along the same tracks (Kitchener line), which also has stops at Union, Weston and Bloor, if you tap on at any one of these stations, PRESTO cannot determine which service (GO Transit or UP Express) a person is using and for how many stations until you tap off, or have set up a default trip and are using a GO Transit device. Having said that, as there is only one type of device at Pearson Airport (UP Express), if you tap on and don’t tap off, the system will recognize and default to the Pearson-Union trip.
Click to expand...
That explanation doesn't hold water, given you are told to use the Green GO machines on UPE if not travelling to/from Pearson. They could easily have one set of machines, and let software figure out if you'd travelled to/from Pearson - just like any other stop.

Unless they ultimately are planning to change the fare structure for those using UP and don't travel to Pearson. (which probably makes sense, given how overcrowded those trains can get).
 
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