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Metrolinx: Presto Fare Card

rbt said:
...

It's like building a 500km long fence. If you can build a 10m fence, then you can build a 500km long fence it'll just take longer and have a few extra bends and perhaps cross a river occasionally so you need to hire the river-fence guy for a few pieces.
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You'll need to hire someone to make sure the 500km long fence is straight and located in the right place. At 10m, you just hope your neighbour does not notice you're taking 10 cm of their property, else you'll need to hire another person with legal experience.
 
Electrify said:
Hamilton only has 200 buses? I'll admit I'm not too familiar with Hamilton's transit system, but I would have assumed they would be second in the GTHA behind Toronto. Never would have guessed it would be smaller than so many suburban municipalities, let alone dead last.
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Hamilton has 221 buses to be exact, but still a far cry from for example Mississauga's 461 buses (as of 2012). Should be no surprise as Mississauga has almost twice the transit ridership of Hamilton (35 million vs. 22 million in 2012), and Mississauga recently surpassed Hamilton in ridership per capita (46 vs. 41 in 2012). Even St-Catharine's has a higher per capita transit ridership than Hamilton now...

These days, Hamilton is more concerned with building freeways through its greenspaces than improving transit.
 
W. K. Lis said:
You'll need to hire someone to make sure the 500km long fence is straight and located in the right place. At 10m, you just hope your neighbour does not notice you're taking 10 cm of their property, else you'll need to hire another person with legal experience.
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In both cases I would be hiring a surveyor if I didn't know where the property line was.

Having had battles with neighbours in the past (they eventually lost their house to their lawyer to cover legal fees after losing numerous court cases against neighbours and the city); it's not worth the risk.
 
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doady said:
Hamilton has 221 buses to be exact, but still a far cry from for example Mississauga's 461 buses (as of 2012). Should be no surprise as Mississauga has almost twice the transit ridership of Hamilton (35 million vs. 22 million in 2012), and Mississauga recently surpassed Hamilton in ridership per capita (46 vs. 41 in 2012). Even St-Catharine's has a higher per capita transit ridership than Hamilton now...

These days, Hamilton is more concerned with building freeways through its greenspaces than improving transit.
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There is also the influence the TTC has on Mississauga because it is next door. Keeping up with the TTC has some benefit, but still needs more.
 
Hamilton is pretty much a self-contained system. HSR connects only with one other local transit service, Burlington Transit. (Mississauga has multiple connections to and from TTC, Brampton and Oakville (and a marginal YRT connection at Humber College) Burlington operates one route into Hamilton's downtown core, and there's a connection with the 18 Waterdown rush-hour only service at Aldershot. Connections to GO are minimal compared to Mississauga.

I'd guess that Mississauga's higher transit ridership per capita is largely due to the subway and GO connections. Hamilton has also been operating pretty much the same system it did 25 years ago, minus trolley buses (the trolley routes - 1, 2 and 3 had better schedules than today) and a few route extensions and one new route on the Mountain.
 
Self-contained transit systems have higher ridership: London, Quebec City, Winnipeg, Victoria - they all have approximately twice the per capita ridership of Hamilton.

Mississauga is not as self-contained as Hamilton, so it is at a disadvantage when it comes to local transit ridership. Mississauga's system cannot serve their residents' needs all by itself. Even travelling from Malton to Albion Centre requires two transfers, for example.

Mississauga is somewhat self-contained: its busiest transit corridor is Hurontario Street, which has no connection to the TTC. This is the reason Mississauga has higher ridership than the rest of the 905. Mississauga residents are more likely to work within Mississauga, and therefore it is easier for its transit system serve their needs.

And of course there's the fact that Mississauga is a post-war suburb, while Hamilton is a real city. There's really no excuse Hamilton to have lower transit ridership than Mississauga. St-Catharines isn't exactly an urban paradise either and it has better ridership also...

The real reason for Hamilton's poor transit ridership is simply neglect of transit. The ridership of HSR has declined by 30 percent in the past 25 years, from a peak of 31 million to 21 million now. The ridership fell again in 2012. This is what happens when a city focuses on things like spending hundreds of millions of dollars to build a freeway through its greenspaces.
 
Has anyone tried using the new PRESTO reader at College Station?

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Apparently it charges $3.00 instead of the usual $2.60...
Also does anyone know the progress with PRESTO integration with the TTC? I haven't heard of anything new being added since the master agreement announcement.
 
This mobile app seems like a waayyy more cost effective solution that presto

http://www.humantransit.org/2013/09/trimets-new-mobile-ticketing-app-reviewed-1.html

Human Transit: TriMet's new mobile ticketing app reviewed:
For as long as I can remember, every bus trip in Portland has started with the counting and recounting of small bills and change held in a sweaty palm, always with the low-level anxiety from the thought of dropping a quarter and being unable to board. Pay your fare at the farebox, recieve a flimsy newsprint ticket. Secret that ticket in a secure pocket, to prevent it from being carried away by a stray gust of wind. If you have to transfer, check your pocket every 30 seconds to make sure it's still there.

TriMet, the transit agency here in Portland, finally launched their long-awaited smartphone app on Wednesday. I've tried it out for most of my trips since, after a summer spent jealously reading tweets from people lucky enough to be invited to the beta test. My first impression: this application suddenly makes using Portland's bus system much more relevant to me, and I suspect to many others.

TriMet's ticketing application was developed by a company called GlobeSherpa, which is in the business of building mobile ticketing software for clients like sports arenas, concert venues, transit agencies, and parking providers. TriMet didn't have to lay anything out financially in developing this tool; angel investors covered those costs. GlobeSherpa skims a percentage off the top of each transaction.
The app is free to download, but once you've got it, you'll have to use a credit or debit card to buy electronic tickets at the usual price. To use a ticket on a trip, you simply press the "use" button, and an animated ticket screen appears. It's as easy as showing this screen to the driver upon boarding; no need to fumble for change or a flimsy paper transfer. This screen remains animated as long as the ticket is good, and shows the exact time at which it expires. It is even possible to use multiple tickets at once, a valuable feature for parents and caregivers.

I'll admit that since relocating back to Portland in 2012, despite living without a car, I have rarely used TriMet's bus network. This is not because it doesn't go to the places I need to travel to, or because it is too infrequent; rather, I simply do not often find myself in possession of change or small bills, and generally choose modes that don't require those things. I pay for most everything using a debit or credit card, because it allows me to track my funds with more accuracy, and because the rounding error that is change adds up over time, but is difficult to spend, keep track of or incorporate back into my accounts.

The agency is no doubt targeting young adults like me in developing this product. Numbers from Pulse, a research arm of Discover, find that members of the Millenial generation have the highest rate of ownership of debit cards (80%) and of contactless payment devices (12%); and the highest rate of online micro payments.

Lest I be accused of spreading propaganda for the agency, it is worth acknowledging that this is a tool useful only to people who have both a credit or debit card and a smartphone. As of May 2013, according to Pew, 56% of Americans had a smartphone, which means that 44% did not. Rates of ownership track with income and educational attainment, but are most strongly correlated with age. This sort of payment system largely excludes seniors, among whom only 18% report ownership of a device capable of running the software. As you might expect, many more Millenials (81%) own smartphones.

Freedom of mobility is a frequent topic here at Human Transit. How well does the network design and operation enable a person to move around the city? How well do the transit agency's materials communicate the possibilities for personal mobility? How does the agency make transit a reasonable choice? In the age of Amazon, Paypal, and in-app purchases, giving riders the option to pay in this way is an important step towards creating a truly civilized transit experience.
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This must cost a fraction of 700m or whatever Presto will ring in at...
 
innsertnamehere said:
Not everyone has a smartphone.
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Not everyone has (or will ever have) a Presto card...

>50% of adults have smartphones in Canada. In a city like Toronto I'd assume even higher proliferation. By 2015-2016, when Presto is up and running in Toronto, smartphone ownership rates will probably be comparable to debit card or credit card ownership.

I think it would be safe to assume smart phones will become, if not already are, ubiquitous parts of life.
 
well yes they will. (or every regular user of transit will) You can't honestly expect a minimum wage employee to buy a smart phone just so they can get their $0.35 discount on tickets.

Also remember that PRESTO was formulated in 2008, back when the Iphone barely existed and 3G was unheard of.
 
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