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GO Transit: Service thread (including extensions)

nfitz said:
I think it was historically about 50/50 if you include car accidents and freight. But for pedestrian incidents - which most of the GO incidents are, it's mostly deliberate.

There's some numbers at http://railwaysuicideprevention.com/railway-fatalities/accident-suicide-comparison.html
Click to expand...

Whoa, that was pretty thorough...even had it down to their behaviour on the track prior to getting hit. Wouldn't have thought this would've bee studied, and in such depth. Good find. Although they have the data down to Prov, I wonder if you're right in most ped incidents being GO-related. I would've thought it might be with freight in more rural or northern communities (but that's just a guess).
 
Grew up in the area...there are a lot of deaths on the rails between Port Credit and Clarkson...

My view on it is that the issue is one of easy access at parks and the level crossings (particularly clarkson rd and lorne park rd).

I would suggest that a big opportunity was missed when they were adding the extra track at port credit across the river, a pedestrian walkway should have been added - there is a lot of temptation to use the railway to cross the river vs. going down to lakeshore.

Both clarkson and LP should have been separated years ago...Stavebank crossing at port credit should be removed...

There also needs to be a under or over Pedestrian/bike crossing at Shawnmarr park and Birchwood parks. There are lots of schools in the area and the circuitous streets make it very attractive to take shortcuts.
 
nfitz said:
I think it was historically about 50/50 if you include car accidents and freight. But for pedestrian incidents - which most of the GO incidents are, it's mostly deliberate.

There's some numbers at http://railwaysuicideprevention.com/railway-fatalities/accident-suicide-comparison.html
Click to expand...

Yeah I was referring to all incidents where there's been a fatality. Seems to me this topic was raised not because of compassion or concern but because of annoyance and regardless of how it happens, whenever there is a fatality there will be huge delays.
 
vegeta_skyline said:
Yeah I was referring to all incidents where there's been a fatality. Seems to me this topic was raised not because of compassion or concern but because of annoyance and regardless of how it happens, whenever there is a fatality there will be huge delays.
Click to expand...

That is correct - I don't really care all that much as to whether it is intentional or unintentional (beyond how such differentiation leads to strategies to prevent service disruption).

AoD
 
vegeta_skyline said:
Yeah I was referring to all incidents where there's been a fatality. Seems to me this topic was raised not because of compassion or concern but because of annoyance and regardless of how it happens, whenever there is a fatality there will be huge delays.
Click to expand...

That's true. It's gotten to the point now where there's little sympathy left, because it's happening so frequently. You have to wonder whether it's their intention to disrupt as many people as possible, or if that's just an unintended consequence of the method they chose.

Maybe a temporary solution would be to install suicide hotline phones at "hot spots"? This is what they did on the Golden Gate Bridge, a very "popular" suicide location. The installation costs would pale in comparison to grade separations and the like, but it may just save a few lives.
 
gweed123 said:
That's true. It's gotten to the point now where there's little sympathy left, because it's happening so frequently. You have to wonder whether it's their intention to disrupt as many people as possible, or if that's just an unintended consequence of the method they chose.

Maybe a temporary solution would be to install suicide hotline phones at "hot spots"? This is what they did on the Golden Gate Bridge, a very "popular" suicide location. The installation costs would pale in comparison to grade separations and the like, but it may just save a few lives.
Click to expand...

The question/problem is - are there even "hot spots", and whether open air railway corridor is a useful place to install phones (vs. stations, in the case of subways) - I don't think the majority of fatalities occur at GO stations. Signage would certainly be an avenue to explore, but there are questions re: efficacy.

As to intent, I wouldn't be surprised some have a "FU society" component to it, but don't see the point of dwelling too much on that either way (beyond the intent to hit at a time of maximum disruption can create opportunity for heightened vigilance). The issue at hand, in the context of GO service is disruption, not whether one is compassionate or not about an individuals' mental condition.

AoD
 
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gweed123 said:
That's true. It's gotten to the point now where there's little sympathy left, because it's happening so frequently. You have to wonder whether it's their intention to disrupt as many people as possible, or if that's just an unintended consequence of the method they chose.

Maybe a temporary solution would be to install suicide hotline phones at "hot spots"? This is what they did on the Golden Gate Bridge, a very "popular" suicide location. The installation costs would pale in comparison to grade separations and the like, but it may just save a few lives.
Click to expand...

The Golden Gate Bridge was the biggest suicide structure in North America. The Prince Edward Viaduct was in second place after that. After they installed the barrier (the Luminous Veil), a study found that it was effective in preventing suicides at the viaduct, but that it did not impact the overall rate of suicide by jumping. Other research has suggested that this is because it just results in suicidal people finding alternative structures, suggesting that other forms of mental health support may be more effective.

Taking this into GO's perspective, suicide barriers at hotspots may be worthwhile for the selfish reason AlvinofDiaspar pointed out: it would reduce service disruptions. Beyond that, I think there's some room for Metrolinx to partner with some other third party to provide crisis support (e.g. phones). As for accidents (trespassers being struck), I have always wondered if there are hotspots for that, and how it correlated with the railway being a barrier (no established crossing around).

I would hope that GO is doing research into this and tracking this kind of stuff, but if they are, why are they so hush-hush about it? This is something worthy to spend some effort researching.
 
The last two places where pedestrians/trespassers have been struck - at Victoria Park and at Port Credit, are in places where the legal pedestrian crossings are nearby. The areas where the railway presents a major barrier, such as along the Newmarket Sub (Barrie Line) north of Eglinton Avenue, are not hotspots.
 
DonValleyRainbow said:
Taking this into GO's perspective, suicide barriers at hotspots may be worthwhile for the selfish reason AlvinofDiaspar pointed out: it would reduce service disruptions. Beyond that, I think there's some room for Metrolinx to partner with some other third party to provide crisis support (e.g. phones). As for accidents (trespassers being struck), I have always wondered if there are hotspots for that, and how it correlated with the railway being a barrier (no established crossing around).
Click to expand...

One quibble - it isn't "selfish" when we are talking about disruption to a service that is used by thousands (if not tens of thousands, in terms of cumulative impact). I consider preventing disruptions to be a top priority whether or not I am using the service.

And it is also important to not fixate on suicides alone - individuals who have no business on the rail corridor should be prevented from having access to it for security reasons alone, period.

AoD
 
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AlvinofDiaspar said:
And it is also important to not fixate on suicides alone - individuals who have no business on the rail corridor should be prevented from having access to it for security reasons alone, period.

AoD
Click to expand...

But at the same time, as much safe and legal access across the rail corridors in urbanised areas should be provided as possible. If it means building more footbridges and tunnels, so be it.
 
ShonTron said:
But at the same time, as much safe and legal access across the rail corridors in urbanised areas should be provided as possible. If it means building more footbridges and tunnels, so be it.
Click to expand...

Yes and no - there should be more legal access across corridors - but their absence should not be construed as a legitimate rationale for intrusion into the corridor.

AoD
 
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