Design of a perfect family condo suite?

[400WellingtonGuy]

Thanks everyone so far for a great conversation!

One thought I had was for parking spots, was that tandem parking spots should be available for families to purchase ie. would be cheaper than buying two individual spots and it is cheaper for the builder to provide. As metroTO suggested, close to elevators as well.

Keep your comments coming.

 

[uptownto]

lead82, midrises also have hallways and elevators. These are costs that scale with size and I doubt there's efficiency because the building is smaller (remember you also have LESS units to help cover those costs!). I also find your example of $1100 monthly fees on 1400 square feet to be not typical at almost $0.80 psf unless you are living at the Ritz or your building is falling apart because of mismanagement. The typical is more around 50 to 55 cents psf.

The freehold townhouse comment is also interesting as a new one will cost the same to purchase as a new apartment of similar size (I checked mls for the bayview/sheppard area which has both types brand new, in both cases cost is 900K). But the townhouses are tall and skinny with lots of wasted space on stairs (also not kid friendly) and with small patios on top of the garages for outdoor space. So apart from condo fees, not much different than apartment living in my opinion when you compare interior and exterior space.

BobBob is basically right. The prices are competitive for a particular area, but still expensive. Big city living is expensive and space comes at a premium. In addition, family sized units are rare, and at 800K or so, people have many choices in lesser locations for more space. There's also a cultural component, call it a stigma in apartment lifestyle for families or whatever. This will likely change if land prices keep escalating. For proof, look at NY where bigger apartments sell for more psf than smaller ones (the opposite of Toronto) and are greatly in demand!

But getting back to this thread, apart from the many great ideas others have already said, the one thing I would have developers consider is designing the unit layouts such that in the future a buyer would be able to easily combine adjacent (including above or below) units into a single living space and whatever consideration that entails.

 

[yaz16]

Unfortunately a condo in the gta is only good for a family with 1 child or 1 child and a baby/toddler. 2 bd and a den usually is the biggest i have seen that are affordable

ideal unit doesn't have two bedrooms sharing a wall. Decent size kitchen. Square balconies/terraces for safety, otherwise ground to lower fl units. Walk in closets and in suite storage.

 

[James]

I think part of the challenge is finding the right balance between size and cost. Naturally, with a family, you'd want a larger unit. THe downside is obviously that a larger unit will be more costly, for both the builder and the buyer. The key features that I would require in a family-oriented condo would be:

- sufficient number of bedrooms (whether it be 2 or 3)
- large front foyer
- adequate closet space in front entrance and in bedrooms
- minimum 2 washrooms
- large windows
- a good community with other families living in the complex
- amenities like swimming pool and entertainment room for the kids and their parties

 

[Calvin]

I wonder whether it is reluctance of families to living on condos led to the lack of family friendly condo supply, or the lack of supply that led to the inability of most families to live in condos.




I have watched too many HGTV shows in which a three or four personal family complains about their 2000sf house no longer working, and I could never understand it. If you have two kids of age 2 and 4, one 120sf room is all that is needed for both of them. People tend to look at what other families are doing, instead of thinking about "what exactly and necessarily do we need". So the issue is not developers are not willing to offer larger units, it is most families still don't want to live in condos. For example, a two bedroom condo is perfect and large enough for a family with one to two small kids. Honestly, I don't see the absolute need of anyone under the age of 14 to have his/her "own room". People are too entitled when it comes to space in North America. A guess room which is vacant for 360 days of the year, are you kidding? And I never understood the need to separate the functions of the livingroom and the family room. Why on earth do the family and their guests have to be entertained in different rooms? It is basically sitting on a couch and watching TV, right?

My parents have two kids, and I never had my own room until I was 15, when my older brother left home for college. We lived in a 850sf two bedroom apartment for years. Never heard my mother complain once "there is not enough space/storage!". If there is not enough storage in the kitchen, stopping having 15 pans/skillets/pots of various sizes! I was happy most of the time, and never felt for a second "my home is too crowded". Honestly, kids seldom feel entitled to larger space. It is usually the vanity of the parents which drive such needs.

What can we say, the vast majority of Canadians are suburban creatures and I don't think it is gonna change. Downtown will continue to be dominated by small condos occupied by singles and childless couples, and 95% of families will still move to their 2000 sf tree lined boring suburbs the minute they have their first born.

I completely agree. I grew up quite nicely thank you in a 900 sq foot bungalow (albeit in the Kingsway). I was an only child but I had families on my street with three children living in a similar home and I never heard of any complaints of size. Unfortunatly now that street of quaint bungalows is slowly morphing into McMansion central!

 

[Hank]

I completely agree. I grew up quite nicely thank you in a 900 sq foot bungalow (albeit in the Kingsway). I was an only child but I had families on my street with three children living in a similar home and I never heard of any complaints of size. Unfortunatly now that street of quaint bungalows is slowly morphing into McMansion central!

Are you talking about the South Kingsway? It amazes me how many McMansions have been built on that stretch of road in the last ten years. As long as that really skinny house stays, though, I'll be happy.