Cops target squeegee kids

[Bruvyman]

Annoying? I find some of them quite intimidating. And it seems for good reason: One guy has the "stupidity" to actually stand up for himself, and he gets his head bashed in. In fact, the very reason I don't stand up for myself when they approach me is because I'm afraid they'll do something to my car, or worse, something to me or my passengers. It's hugely foolish to call them merely "annoying". They should be outlawed.

P.S. What I do find annoying is the suggestion that because they're less fortunate than the rest of us, and because it's an issue with many facets, we should just accept their intimidation.

Again, on what basis or justification would you outlaw them?

And I guess I'm foolish because I do find them to be nothing more or less than an irritant and annoyance. I have never had any intimidating encounters with them. I would bet that there are plenty aggressive and intimidating squeegee kids out there, but I hardly think that that is a result of the squeegee in their hands.

 

[Ak2809]

Annoying? I find some of them quite intimidating. And it seems for good reason: One guy has the "stupidity" to actually stand up for himself, and he gets his head bashed in. In fact, the very reason I don't stand up for myself when they approach me is because I'm afraid they'll do something to my car, or worse, something to me or my passengers. It's hugely foolish to call them merely "annoying". They should be outlawed.

P.S. What I do find annoying is the suggestion that because they're less fortunate than the rest of us, and because it's an issue with many facets, we should just accept their intimidation.

So the answer is to ban groups of people you find intimidating?

Do you honestly think this is a valid long term solution?

 

[Eug]

So the answer is to ban groups of people you find intimidating?

Ban people from accosting you, violating your private property, and then asking for money for that? Hell ya.

Again, on what basis or justification would you outlaw them?

I'm not a lawyer, but if there isn't an existing law that could be used to ban these actions, then we maybe we should look hard at creating one.

And I guess I'm foolish because I do find them to be nothing more or less than an irritant and annoyance.

Yet someone just had their head bashed in.

I have never had any intimidating encounters with them.

Yet others have. I have had some curse at me (and I did nothing - which is the problem I guess, because I didn't give them any money either), and I know people who have had them spit on their cars.

I would bet that there are plenty aggressive and intimidating squeegee kids out there, but I hardly think that that is a result of the squeegee in their hands.

Huh? That doesn't even make sense.

 

[Ak2809]

It seems that what you want is to simply ban solicitation of any service period, is that right?

 

[GraphicMatt]

Under the Safe Streets Act of 2001, the activities of squeegee kids are already illegal. So is aggressive panhandling. Also panhandling at bus stops, taxi stands, ATMs and parking lots. All illegal.

Fines range from $500 - $1000. Or six months in jail.

The problem with the law, of course, is that people who panhandle tend not to have identification, nor the means to pay a fine. Jail time is incredibly expensive and not overly effective. Social programs have shown success in getting people off the streets, but those are decried as wasteful these days. Go figure.

 

[Eug]

Under the Safe Streets Act of 2001, the activities of squeegee kids are already illegal. So is aggressive panhandling. Also panhandling at bus stops, taxi stands, ATMs and parking lots. All illegal.

Good.

The problem with the law, of course, is that people who panhandle tend not to have identification, nor the means to pay a fine. Jail time is incredibly expensive and not overly effective. Social programs have shown success in getting people off the streets, but those are decried as wasteful these days. Go figure.

All problems I'm sure, and I do support social support programs to help get kids off the street. Nonetheless I find it appalling that some here think it's perfectly acceptable that people are allowed to violate your property and then demand money for it.

It seems that what you want is to simply ban solicitation of any service period, is that right?

Nope not at all, so stop with the bizarre leaps in logic.

 

[Ak2809]

Yet someone just had their head bashed in.

This is bad logic. You can't justify your opinion based on rare violent confrontations.

All problems I'm sure, and I do support social support programs to help get kids off the street. Nonetheless I find it appalling that some here think it's perfectly acceptable that people are allowed to violate your property and then demand money for it.

No one is supporting anyone's right to violate your property. I'm simply rejecting your idea of criminalising people who offer their services simply because you're afraid of them.

If someone damages your car or assaults you, that is a completely different situation from someone just offering to clean your windshield and the two situations should not be combined.

Nope not at all, so stop with the bizarre leaps in logic.

Then why bring an intimidation factor into this? It seems you want to ban a practice simply because some of those who offer it may possibly cause damage to your vehicle or assault you.

This sounds awfully paranoid to me.

 

[Eug]

If someone damages your car or assaults you, that is a completely different situation from someone just offering to clean your windshield and the two situations should not be combined.

Except they are combined, by the squeegee kids themselves. Many "clean" your windshield even if you shake your head telling them not to.

This is not a business, nor a service, so stop hiding behind that claim. This is their way of intimidating people into giving them money, and it's unfortunate some people here are foolish to actually buy into it.

BTW, I remember mention I believe here at Urbantoronto that one person observed a squeegee kid pissing into his water bucket and then proceeding to "clean" some windshields. I guess this is their way of cutting costs in their service industry.

 

[Ak2809]

Except they are combined, by the squeegee kids themselves.

So, every single squeegee kid has or will assault you / damage your car?

 

[Bruvyman]

I'm not a lawyer, but if there isn't an existing law that could be used to ban these actions, then we maybe we should look hard at creating one.

but again, on what grounds would you create this law?

 

[Bruvyman]

Under the Safe Streets Act of 2001, the activities of squeegee kids are already illegal. So is aggressive panhandling. Also panhandling at bus stops, taxi stands, ATMs and parking lots. All illegal.

Fines range from $500 - $1000. Or six months in jail.

The problem with the law, of course, is that people who panhandle tend not to have identification, nor the means to pay a fine. Jail time is incredibly expensive and not overly effective. Social programs have shown success in getting people off the streets, but those are decried as wasteful these days. Go figure.

I believe you are mistaken. The Safe Streets act in no way bans the activities of squeegee kids unless they are plying their "trade" in an aggressive or disruptive manner.

 

[GraphicMatt]

I believe you are mistaken. The Safe Streets act in no way bans the activities of squeegee kids unless they are plying their "trade" in an aggressive or disruptive manner.

It prohibits anyone from soliciting money from people who are "in or on a stopped, standing or parked vehicle."

Here's the law: http://www.e-laws.gov.on.ca/html/statutes/english/elaws_statutes_99s08_e.htm

 

[Bruvyman]

It prohibits anyone from soliciting money from people who are "in or on a stopped, standing or parked vehicle."

Here's the law: http://www.e-laws.gov.on.ca/html/statutes/english/elaws_statutes_99s08_e.htm

Right you are.

 

[Ak2809]

Darting in and out of traffic to solicit squeegee services IS dangerous and should be banned.

What I'm taking issue with is the idea that squeegee kids should be jailed because:

A. Some people consider them intimidating
B. They may possibly assault someone
C. They may possibly damage someone's property

Using these reasons as justification for this law is just ridiculous and paranoid.

 

[Eug]

Darting in and out of traffic to solicit squeegee services IS dangerous and should be banned.

What I'm taking issue with is the idea that squeegee kids should be jailed because:

A. Some people consider them intimidating
B. They may possibly assault someone
C. They may possibly damage someone's property

Using these reasons as justification for this law is just ridiculous and paranoid.

Do you drive in these areas? To make money doing this they need to intimidate and violate your property, and yes by "intimidate and violate" I include "cleaning" your windshield. Do you really think that anyone wants this "service"? Don't tell me you think people drive down to Lakeshore and Spadina to get their windshields cleaned. This intimidation is used to extract money.

This is justification for arrest, and I'm glad the law agrees with me.