Condo Boards & Reserve Funds: Perils Lurk in Older Condos

[PinkLucy]

Having spent that past couple of years on a condo board, I agree with your summary above Having been involved with boards and committees in general for many years, I've found that the best way to get a know-it-all, loud-mouthed troublemaker to be quiet is to ask him/her to get involved. They either stop talking or they find out that it isn't as inexpensive/easy/quick to get things done as they thought.

I have always appreciated people who ask tough questions, but people who just like to get others riled up are a complete PITA

 

[Davidackerman]

Great comment. My experiences exactly. There's no shortage of complainers. But scarcity of doers

 

[Ex-Montreal Girl]

Having spent that past couple of years on a condo board, I agree with your summary above Having been involved with boards and committees in general for many years, I've found that the best way to get a know-it-all, loud-mouthed troublemaker to be quiet is to ask him/her to get involved. They either stop talking or they find out that it isn't as inexpensive/easy/quick to get things done as they thought.

I have always appreciated people who ask tough questions, but people who just like to get others riled up are a complete PITA

They are sometimes worse that PITAs. They are also serious time and MONEY wasters, people who cost the entire community because, unable to handle petty complaints (e.g. noise) in a normal, friendly manner, they call their lawyers.

 

[PinkLucy]

True enough. My favourite: I am going to sue the corporation for putting a lien on me because I forgot to pay my maintenance fees.

Yeah, you go right ahead with that ....

 

[Ex-Montreal Girl]

True enough. My favourite: I am going to sue the corporation for putting a lien on me because I forgot to pay my maintenance fees.

Yeah, you go right ahead with that ....

Yeah, meanwhile, your lawyers are billing you $300-plus an hour.

The worst are those cabals that actually include lawyers. Bad lawyers.

 

[js97]

They should make all Condo owners attend/read/review basic condo knowledge and write an exam.

Majority of owners know very little and this would most likely improve engagement management and support of these corps.

 

[PinkLucy]

Probably my biggest pet peeve is people not understanding that they live in a community with shared facilities which requires some rules. Or actually my bigger pet peeve is probably people who do ridiculous things requiring that rules be created in the first place.

Not everyone is cut out for condo living but you should do your homework and know what to expect if you choose to live in one.

As Ex-MG noted, condo owners should remember that board members are also owners (generally), but some board members also need to remember that they are representing all owners, not just themselves.

 

[doug]

Not all condo boards are as good and professional as you are.
I'm aware of a particular board that completely ignores requests for basic maintenance, such as a leaking roof drain pipe that passes through a suite. This is a common element, it does not serve one suite exclusively, as this board claims.
After exhausting all other avenues in mitigating noise, a resident asked their board to enforce the noise bylaws. The board ignored all requests until lawyers had to be involved.
Ordering the installation of flooring in a common element hallway, to take place between the hours of 11PM and 6AM is not necessary or considerate to residents. No attempt to coordinate the installation with residents was attempted.
Not all condo boards are the same, i'm glad yours are professional and responsive.

 

[Ex-Montreal Girl]

Probably my biggest pet peeve is people not understanding that they live in a community with shared facilities which requires some rules. Or actually my bigger pet peeve is probably people who do ridiculous things requiring that rules be created in the first place.

Not everyone is cut out for condo living but you should do your homework and know what to expect if you choose to live in one.

As Ex-MG noted, condo owners should remember that board members are also owners (generally), but some board members also need to remember that they are representing all owners, not just themselves.

Funny you mention that. One among us needs constant reminding ... In fact, I and another member were just discussing how to handle this. I wish we could vote this person off the board island. If only the rest of us could tell all the residents the truth.

 

[Ex-Montreal Girl]

Not all condo boards are as good and professional as you are.
I'm aware of a particular board that completely ignores requests for basic maintenance, such as a leaking roof drain pipe that passes through a suite. This is a common element, it does not serve one suite exclusively, as this board claims.
After exhausting all other avenues in mitigating noise, a resident asked their board to enforce the noise bylaws. The board ignored all requests until lawyers had to be involved.
Ordering the installation of flooring in a common element hallway, to take place between the hours of 11PM and 6AM is not necessary or considerate to residents. No attempt to coordinate the installation with residents was attempted.
Not all condo boards are the same, i'm glad yours are professional and responsive.

I am sorry to hear of your pain(s). And I am well aware of the fact that not all boards are the same. That's why I felt I had to run. People have to step up or shut up. Not that I am perfect, but I am hard-working and committed. And I can say the same of three out of the other four members, all of who bring differing skill sets to the table. The fourth, unfortunately, won a popularity contest. Thankfully, the rest of us can minimize the damage caused.

The thing is, people can't expect good boards to just happen. Every resident has a responsibility to ensure that the best people get on the board, by asking questions (what do you stand for? what are your skills? etc.) and by helping those people win by distributing leaflets, talking them up to neighbours, organizing meet-ups in their suites or party rooms or whatever.

I think too many condo owners are content to sit back, not attend meetings, not get involved, then allow issues to get out of hand and, only when matters are out of control, start to do something. Sometimes that something is sell out and move, which drives down values for all.

Maybe it's because I am a former house owner that I understand what is involved in taking responsibility for one's property and investment. Maybe I am just a control queen. All I know is, it's too damned important for me to trust just anybody with my home and money.

 

[doug]

Maybe it's because I am a former house owner that I understand what is involved in taking responsibility for one's property and investment. Maybe I am just a control queen. All I know is, it's too damned important for me to trust just anybody with my home and money.

I agree, I bought a house....an old one, that needs lots of work, but at least I can prioritize what's necessary, and do the cosmetic stuff when time an money permits.
Not necessarily true in a condo.

 

[PinkLucy]

Not all condo boards are as good and professional as you are.
I'm aware of a particular board that completely ignores requests for basic maintenance, such as a leaking roof drain pipe that passes through a suite. This is a common element, it does not serve one suite exclusively, as this board claims.
After exhausting all other avenues in mitigating noise, a resident asked their board to enforce the noise bylaws. The board ignored all requests until lawyers had to be involved.
Ordering the installation of flooring in a common element hallway, to take place between the hours of 11PM and 6AM is not necessary or considerate to residents. No attempt to coordinate the installation with residents was attempted.
Not all condo boards are the same, i'm glad yours are professional and responsive.

As Ex-MG says, I also felt the need to run because I know I'd have a lot to say, so I might as well do it in an official capacity . Also, I don't trust anyone else to look after my investment! (are we twins?)

We are in a good situation now after having a couple of do-nothings and in-it-for-my-resume types on the board that fortunately resigned of their own accord. Having a well-respected board can also encourage good candidates to step forward because the "good" people want to be on an effective board. On the other hand, sometimes it's hard to get people to run when a good board is in place because people are happy and don't see the need to run, but I firmly believe that change is a good thing and people shouldn't be on a board for all eternity.

I strongly support some of the proposed changes to condo law that will require property management to be certified and I believe also require directors to do some training -- you do need to know what you're doing on any board!

 

[Condo Madness]

The root problem is that the Condo Act is self-policing. So if there is a dispute between the board and an owner, the lawyers are called in.

There are owners who are hit with $40,000 to $73,000 legal bills from the condo's law firm on top of their own legal fees when they lose a court case. For sure owners lose far more often than they win.

On the other hand, when a board ignores an owner's just complaints, they are leaving themselves open to an expensive lawsuit. The oppression remedy that an owner has can be expensive. One owner in a condo on Gerrard has started a $1 million suit against the condo corporation. She already won an award of about $60,000 because the board would not deal with noise from an upstairs tenant.

I am very reluctant to advise people to start legal action. It can spin out of control and become so expensive, so quickly.

As far as having a rogue director on the board, as long as the majority constantly out votes him/her, you can live with it. It is when idiots, or worse, gain the majority, that you have a serious problem.

Every board is different. Some are great and they work well together. Others will wreak a building in a very short time.

 

[Ex-Montreal Girl]

The root problem is that the Condo Act is self-policing. So if there is a dispute between the board and an owner, the lawyers are called in.

There are owners who are hit with $40,000 to $73,000 legal bills from the condo's law firm on top of their own legal fees when they lose a court case. For sure owners lose far more often than they win.

On the other hand, when a board ignores an owner's just complaints, they are leaving themselves open to an expensive lawsuit. The oppression remedy that an owner has can be expensive. One owner in a condo on Gerrard has started a $1 million suit against the condo corporation. She already won an award of about $60,000 because the board would not deal with noise from an upstairs tenant.

I am very reluctant to advise people to start legal action. It can spin out of control and become so expensive, so quickly.

As far as having a rogue director on the board, as long as the majority constantly out votes him/her, you can live with it. It is when idiots, or worse, gain the majority, that you have a serious problem.

Every board is different. Some are great and they work well together. Others will wreak a building in a very short time.

Our problem is not a rogue so much as a self-entitled arrogant egomaniac. For example, in the aftermath of the blackout, this person demanded special treatment from management. The rest of us had to put a stop to that. We did all the heavy lifting to ensure our building functioned as best as possible under some very difficult circumstances while this person just took credit and glad handed. Interestingly, this person has been on the board for many years while the rest of us have served a year or less.

Anyway, about training for board members. I would submit only under pressure. I give enough time, more than enough time, and can recite the current Act cold. I also try to stay on top of the law, including case law, via this forum, Condo Madness and other Internet sites.

 

[PinkLucy]

Our problem is not a rogue so much as a self-entitled arrogant egomaniac. For example, in the aftermath of the blackout, this person demanded special treatment from management. The rest of us had to put a stop to that. We did all the heavy lifting to ensure our building functioned as best as possible under some very difficult circumstances while this person just took credit and glad handed. Interestingly, this person has been on the board for many years while the rest of us have served a year or less.

Anyway, about training for board members. I would submit only under pressure. I give enough time, more than enough time, and can recite the current Act cold. I also try to stay on top of the law, including case law, via this forum, Condo Madness and other Internet sites.

Very few new condo directors know much about the act (or their own condo declaration) and would benefit from training. If you can cite the Act, I'd say you're the exception.

The CCI offers courses. The intro one is only a couple of hours and can be done online. It provides basic info on the role of a director which is often news to people new to a board.