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Chinatown East: Zhong Hua Men Gate

ok.. I really gotta stand up here on this one. This happens to be my neighbourhood, and no, chinatown east is far from dieing. Is is very understandable how people who do not live here would think that it might be marginalized, unimportant, ignored, and facing certain death. However, the truth is that it's character and its nature is very much different than chinatown west. Comparing the two is like comparing apples to oranges. And they are very independent of eachother. Chinatown east is not the tourist destination that chinatown west is. Chinatown east is basically in the service of local Chinese, which btw, there are many of us here, and I doubt that will change any time soon. It is full of many small stores, run locally, for the local market, it's got a very intimate personality and many of the people here know eachother, and most of us are regulars also. I think if people get to really know chinatown east, they would see how quaint it is, compared to the bigger, louder, more commercial chinatown to the west. Our community is quite strong, and we cherish this community.

For the arguments as to 'why is chinatown east getting this and not chinatown west'. Well aside from my comments regarding the strong sense of community pride here, this arch was proposed YEARS ago. And I've been waiting a really really long time to see it go up, I thought it was dead, so I'm very excited. We're getting it because we came up with it, we proposed it for our community, and we worked hard to make it happen. That is why it is here, and not there. If they, over on the west side, decided to create something similar, i'm sure they could also be successful, but to this point in time, they have not.

I will restate, this was our (the chinatown east community) idea, so of course it should stay here, and it's not unjustified here because "it would be better over there".

I hope this will make the community more visible, because as of now, it's very easy to drive by without taking much notice.

I pass by the site where this gateway is to rise, and it makes me smile every time.

Please, be happy for us! And, I assure you, chinatown east is alive and very well!
 
Not to mention within walking distance of Gerrard Square, Riverdale Park, and....Jilly's!
 
I wouldn't hold out high hopes for Ka Ka. The red sign/green sign convention is damn near 100% accurate on Spadina, assuming that the trend carries over to Gerrard there's no way I'd eat there.
 
o and to urbandreamer: 'ka ka' means family, specifically 'ka' means family, 'ka ka lok' is the rough pronunciation of the restaurant's name, that's where i surmise 'lucky' came from. 'lok' means happiness. 'ka ka lok' basically means happy family, or families (as in all families). On the side, the 'ka' is actually 'ga' and I could nvr understand why they use 'k'.. but yea.. now u kno~ :p
 
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When I was at Ryerson, I worked part time for the architect who did the design for Zhong Hua Men. The classmate who brought me to work there actually did some of the AutoCAD drawings for the gate, using references from traditional Chinese architecture.

I think it's great that the gate project will be a go. Chinatown East is a part of the city that is often ignored, and I might say is in a life-and-death struggle with the T&T down in the Portlands. The gate will provide a new landmark to the neighbourhood.

However this gate is nothing like the Chinatown gates in other cities. First, this one will not be built over a street but on a street corner (the parking lot SE of Gerrard and Hamilton, just west of Broadview). The models of the gate (I saw them while working for the architect) show digital and analog clocks on the sides of the gate... features that I'd rather not see on the gate.

As for a Chinatown gate in the Spadina/Dundas area, I have heard about a proposal for a gate over Huron Street just north of Dundas. However this was a long time ago. The project's probably dead by now.
 
I really don't see what the point of these arches is, I've always been glad the Spadina China town avoided it. It just seems so tacky. We all know this isn't China, why pretend? Maybe we should mandate all shopkeepers where rice hats and refer to non asian clients as taipan, too. We don't expect little Italy to put up mock Coliseums and Leaning Towers. If it must be made, politics being politics, at least try to do it in a more contemporary Chinese-Canadian manner. Not some crude attempt to knock off Las Vegas.
 
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Whoaccio said:
I really don't see what the point of these arches is, I've always been glad the Spadina China town avoided it. It just seems so tacky. We all know this isn't China, why pretend? Maybe we should mandate all shopkeepers where rice hats and refer to non asian clients as taipan, too. We don't expect little Italy to put up mock Coliseums and Leaning Towers. If it must be made, politics being politics, at least try to do it in a more contemporary Chinese-Canadian manner. Not some crude attempt to knock off Las Vegas.
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Nobody's mandating anything. The people of Chinatown want a gate. If they want to wear rice hats too, it's their decision. Is it surprising that when Chinese people get together and build something, it might look... Chinese?

Or did you want something more like chicken balls and red sauce? :p
 
Whoaccio said:
I really don't see what the point of these arches is, I've always been glad the Spadina China town avoided it. It just seems so tacky. We all know this isn't China, why pretend? Maybe we should mandate all shopkeepers where rice hats and refer to non asian clients as taipan, too. We don't expect little Italy to put up mock Coliseums and Leaning Towers. If it must be made, politics being politics, at least try to do it in a more contemporary Chinese-Canadian manner. Not some crude attempt to knock off Las Vegas.
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So Who, is this gate out front of Mississauga's Chinese Cultural Centre tacky?

45474248_1acbf3bab1.jpg
 
A question though - you say, traffic in the area will grow, why?
Are there any new projects in that area?
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As I mentioned, just across the Gerrard Street bridge is a little $1 Billion makeover that's underway.
 
Whoaccio said:
We all know this isn't China, why pretend? Maybe we should mandate all shopkeepers where rice hats and refer to non asian clients as taipan, too.
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Sigh, thank God somebody else feels the way I do. This kind of crap drives me nuts, and the fact that it was planned 10 years ago doesn't surprise me! I'm all for monuments and street art etc but why wouldn't the people of the community have designed something more relevent or representational for them and their lives in the 'here and now', which is to say inspired by the traditional gates of China, possibly, but with a modern new feel, in a way that says 'Toronto' not 'Beijing'. This isn't China. This isn't Disneyland. This is a modern diverse city where even the notion of a Chinatown or Greektown or Gay Village seems outdated. Time and time again we hear of people in various communities feeling marginalized and disenfranchised, and yet they continue to ghettoize and build their monuments to the motherland!?

With the input of Torontonians of all backgrounds, all design aesthetics and traditions this city should be creating its own stamp on its built/artistic landscape, one that feels truly compelling, unique and 'forward'. But whether its NOTL 'New Town' or this sort of 'Epcot Centre'-themed approach to communitites in Toronto it all smacks of derivative, historicist cheese that increasingly nobody gives a poop about.

Having said all of that there is of course important history to the presence of Chinese people who immigrated to Toronto that should be commemorated appropriately with plaques and in the Museum of Toronto (oh wait we don't have one!), and as I understand it there is also a heritage/tourist precedent for traditional Chinatowns in many cities including Toronto that is an argument in support of their preservation. When you start having 'Chinatowns' or 'Little Italys' pop up all over the place, however, you do have to ask yourself if this is simply ghettoization, whether imposed or self-imposed and whether this is positive or not. I say not.
 
I don't think there is anything wrong with the Chinese gate, nothing at all..

In fact, I think these 'links with the past' are rather charming - what's wrong with that?
 
Tewder said:
Sigh, thank God somebody else feels the way I do. This kind of crap drives me nuts, and the fact that it was planned 10 years ago doesn't surprise me! I'm all for monuments and street art etc but why wouldn't the people of the community have designed something more relevent or representational for them and their lives in the 'here and now', which is to say inspired by the traditional gates of China, possibly, but with a modern new feel, in a way that says 'Toronto' not 'Beijing'. This isn't China. This isn't Disneyland. This is a modern diverse city where even the notion of a Chinatown or Greektown or Gay Village seems outdated. Time and time again we hear of people in various communities feeling marginalized and disenfranchised, and yet they continue to ghettoize and build their monuments to the motherland!?
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I know. How dare we try to have distinct neighbourhoods? How dare local BIAs try to push for street furniture that would attract business and tourists? How dare local ethnic merchants cluster - that creates ghettos! Who do the gays think they are, clustering gay bars together? The city should be a melting pot.

And if you think Toronto is bad, I hope one can find solace in Brampton, or Mississauga, or Markham - except that they also have ethnic malls too. So much for the suburbs.

We should kill the Village and Chinatown and Chinatown East and Little Italy like Adam Vaughan is trying to kill Clubland. Why, just up Broadview from the proposed gate is the Sun Yat-Sen statue. What has Sun Yat-Sen done for anyone lately? He wasn't even Canadian.

Having said all of that there is of course important history to the presence of Chinese people who immigrated to Toronto that should be commemorated appropriately with plaques and in the Museum of Toronto (oh wait we don't have one!),
Click to expand...

So you're asking for a museum of tolerance?
 
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