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2010: Turning Point?

There was a time when I kind of hoped NFITZ would designate me as a liar or a bigot, there would have been a cachet to have been centred out by a major Gong Show character like him. The dream has faded however, he is no longer the guy I would have been proud to say hated me. NFITZ you spiralled down to become a loon unworthy of respect or even the time it takes to read your posts.
 
Some of the participants in this thread really need to get a grip. They might do well to take a tranquilizer, tone down their prejudiced statements, look up at the sky and see that it's not falling, and wait a reasonable time (a bit more than a month?) to see what actually happens.
 
spider said:
There was a time when I kind of hoped NFITZ would designate me as a liar or a bigot, there would have been a cachet to have been centred out by a major Gong Show character like him. The dream has faded however, he is no longer the guy I would have been proud to say hated me. NFITZ you spiralled down to become a loon unworthy of respect or even the time it takes to read your posts.
Click to expand...
This is a personal attack, without any basis. Why are the moderators allowing this?

A bigot becoming electable is a huge turning point. That is the only point I'm making. Perhaps posters could stay on subject ...
 
When it comes to the anti-immigration, anti-"Oriental", etc angle on said "bigotry", if one examines the apparent voting patterns, the chickens voted for Colonel Sanders, no?

(As I've said before, given his record, it's noteworthy that Don Cherry did *not* pile upon hyphenated-Canadians in his address.)
 
I've said before that the Ford's anti-immigration and stereotypical comments don't prove he a racist bigot. (though I have to wonder how many comments one can say that sound racist, without being a racist ...).

It's strictly his anti-gay bigotry I'm referring to; that he doesn't support same-sex marriage is without a doubt.
 
adma said:
When it comes to the anti-immigration, anti-"Oriental", etc angle on said "bigotry", if one examines the apparent voting patterns, the chickens voted for Colonel Sanders, no?
Click to expand...

Being the son of immigrants, and having spent more than my fair time around immigrant Torontonians, my impression is that most New Canadians don't care about bigotry being directed toward them, have never been the victims of an overt hate crime, and generally harbour bigotries of their own.

Taking offense to racist remarks is actually something of a white, established Canadian obsession.
 
Nfitz: I think you're putting too many eggs in the "anti-gay" basket, all the more so when you conflate it into the SSM issue.

Now, if it comes to the point where Ford actively sets out to ban SSM in Toronto, then, Houston, we have a problem. The mitigating factor being that any such bid would draw horselaughs against the larger tableau, and leave him (and Brother Doug, I presume) as isolated in the new Council as he was on the old Council, with even his own so-called allies and committee-chair colleagues steering clear. More likely, whether from within or (more likely) from without, the libertarian impulse will kick in and he'll steer clear on behalf of the status quo--in which case, be thankful that SSM already exists...
 
adma said:
Nfitz: I think you're putting too many eggs in the "anti-gay" basket, all the more so when you conflate it into the SSM issue.

Now, if it comes to the point where Ford actively sets out to ban SSM in Toronto, then, Houston, we have a problem. The mitigating factor being that any such bid would draw horselaughs against the larger tableau, and leave him (and Brother Doug, I presume) as isolated in the new Council as he was on the old Council, with even his own so-called allies and committee-chair colleagues steering clear. More likely, whether from within or (more likely) from without, the libertarian impulse will kick in and he'll steer clear on behalf of the status quo--in which case, be thankful that SSM already exists...
Click to expand...
Ford's anti-gay bigotry really have no bearing on the actions he'll take in office. Given that it's entirely a federal and provincial matter. So on one hand it doesn't matter. It's that the electorate is willing to knowingly elect a bigot which is the issue. And while Ford will do nothing, what will another leader at another level do?
 
nfitz said:
And while Ford will do nothing, what will another leader at another level do?
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Harper already "tried"; and the status quo held, even w/the help of some of his own caucus. And something tells me that as time moves forward, the likelihood of reversal becomes less and less, unless Harper gets himself a whoomping Diefenbaker-scaled majority that's overwhelmingly so-con. And provincially, I've my doubts that Hudak'll "go there", either--wouldn't want to piss off the "libertarian middle", you know. If SSM already exists, wouldn't a reversal count as "government interference"? If you're elected on an anti-big-government platform, it may be better not to bother.

The USA, of course, is another matter.
 
I doubt we'll ever be in danger of losing SSM, which is great, but I still don't like the idea of giving a pass to old dudes who spout "I believe in traditional marriage" whenever asked. Because fundamentally all they're saying is "That's icky!" like they're 12-years-old. We demand better.
 
Traditional marriage? Isn't that when your spouse is the same race but a different gender than you? Or is it when your spouse is barefoot, pregnant, and in the kitchen.

Or perhaps it's when you were still allowed to rape your wife ... or marry 10-year olds ...
 
Honestly, if you take a look at many comments Ford has made without context a lot of them come off as doady / nfitz have interpreted above - and rightfully so.
When the bigger picture is considered I don't think he really falls into any of these categories. I think it's clear he's against gay marriage (and it's likely a good 0-40% of the population also is) but he did state his beliefs wouldn't intervene with politics (yes, after the fact and very timely). Harper shares a similar belief if you recall but we've heard no mention of this in many years now.

I think as it's been mentioned before Ford doesn't strike me as the type of person that leads - simply in the sense that I think he surrounds him self with what he views are good leader's. On his own I believe he's goofy (I chose this word because I can't think of anything better) but I'm not overly concerned as I don't believe he's going to be making many decisions - but he'll take all the credit without a doubt.
 
Oh, and if you think Mayor Ford is going to try and petition PM Harper and/or Premier Hudak to roll back SSM or whatever, that'd make Mayor Mel calling in the troops to battle the Blizzard of '99 look perfectly sane and rational. Then we'd *really* be talking about a rogue mayor...
 
I don't think Ford as Mayor is a threat to SSM, but Ford as Premier might be. (Trust me, his brother Doug is already hard at work on that grand vision...)
 
adma said:
Oh, and if you think Mayor Ford is going to try and petition PM Harper and/or Premier Hudak to roll back SSM or whatever, that'd make Mayor Mel calling in the troops to battle the Blizzard of '99 look perfectly sane and rational. Then we'd *really* be talking about a rogue mayor...
Click to expand...
Why would he do something like that ... that makes absolutely no sense.
 
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