Observer Walt
Senior Member
Welcome to the site Pips. You echo comments I have made once or twice here. Let's keep it respectful.
|
|
|
- Status
Welcome to the site Pips. You echo comments I have made once or twice here. Let's keep it respectful.
Observer Walt
Senior Member
Roy's Square wasn't the greatest, but it was better than nothing. Perhaps the City should revisit the policy on demolition permits, and not approve demolition until it is evident that new construction will proceed within a fairly short time frame.
Redroom Studios
Senior Member
I found that article by Hume rather weak and I cant say I agree with anything he said in it. Even if I was a supporter of the public square idea... it wouldnt really work here as the surroundings do nothing to support its presence. That is to say that public squares work best if they are in place from the beginning of an areas development rather than randomly plunked down where there is a bit of open space.
Hypnotoad
Senior Member
Here here. I think Hume is way off base in his article and you're right by calling it weak and poorly thought out.
An open space for the sake of an open space cast in the shadows of mediocre architecture does not an inviting place make. Rather, this site is ideal for a vibrant, engaging and interactive street experience. If it is not to be a tall skyscraper then why not a multi-use institution, like a museum, concert hall, arts centre, convention centre, aquarium, ballet, etc etc... Basically, an alternative to a tower is something else that generates traffic but isn't just an empty plot with landscaping.
As for public spaces, Toronto has many that need significant revitalization. I'd rather Toronto and its corporate citizens work on improving those that already exist instead of creating a patchwork of disconnected, poorly planned "squares" that make little-to-no sense. Nathan Phillips Square is the perfect example of what Hume wants.
androiduk
Senior Member
I don't mind a square here but why does it have to be all or nothing. Why not have retail on the south and east side of the site and the rest could be open. The income from the much needed retail would take care of the square and pay for security, etc.
TOareaFan
Superstar
A typical construction loan is structured as multiple advances as costs are incurred and is usually just calculated as a percentage of all project costs (land, hard construction costs, soft costs {laywers, consultants, etc) and financing costs) so a "much larger construction loan" would:
a) pay off the land the land loan
b) include within the loan an interest reserve that would be drawn on each month to pay the interest costs of the loan itself until the source of the ultimate repayment of the loan - the closing of the condo and hotel sales- were available.
What I do not understand is how this project gets completed, though. if the the total costs are, say, $500 million and they have $70 million in deposits (assuming they can all be used in the project....not necessarily true) and they have arranged a construction loan of $195 from "BTA" (assuming they are ready/willing/able to fund) then that leaves $235 million short.....that would be an unusually high percentage of equity for a developer to invest in a project!
Lots of people have pointed out the negative aspects of the building shrinking from 80 floors to, what, 67 floors. How about the positive aspects of the guy who bought on the 67 floor thinking he had bought a ho-hum unit in an upper (but not top) floor! Didn't he just win the condo lottery having, now, the premium top floor unit
Last edited:
Archivist
Senior Member
I agree with others who disagree with Hume in that a public square here is not necessarily the best choice, and that some other proposal (either cultural or office) with good ground-level programming would be best. As it stands right now, the site does not "deserve" the treatment of a square as the surrounds are not engaging enough to warrant it.
Let's have a new proposal for this site, and perhaps the clothing store on the other side could become a square some day, once the intersection is already improved a lot from what it is now.
Let's have a new proposal for this site, and perhaps the clothing store on the other side could become a square some day, once the intersection is already improved a lot from what it is now.
vultur09
Banned
The developer lacked credibility from the start and demonstrated his lack of credibility in every misstep that led him to this predictable point. This was obvious to my cousin and should have been obvious to anyone capable of independent and critical thought. The situation is unfolding exactly as my cousin predicted.
alklay
Senior Member
Great for your cousin!!
I agree with the posts above that a public square is not the right solution for this corner.
I am more interested in seeing a building that adds to the street level with decent shops, a variety of uses (retail, hotel and condo is a great mix), and a decent streetscape. I couldn't care less if the top 13 stories are knocked off, as long as the first 6 stories add the needed respect to the intersection.
I agree with the posts above that a public square is not the right solution for this corner.
I am more interested in seeing a building that adds to the street level with decent shops, a variety of uses (retail, hotel and condo is a great mix), and a decent streetscape. I couldn't care less if the top 13 stories are knocked off, as long as the first 6 stories add the needed respect to the intersection.
cdr108
Senior Member
^ ^ ^
the phoenix, um, vultur, rises.
the phoenix, um, vultur, rises.
TOareaFan
Superstar
There is an opportunity to solve a lot of the city's issues and merge a bunch of threads on UT together making life easier for the mods.
Build a hockey rink here and build 67 stories of condo above.....the end result will be +/- 80 stories, it would attract local developers and cash and it would bring that second NHL team to the GTA.
There, done, now I can move on and solve that airport rail link issue over the transportation forums (<------that guy means I am kidding)
Build a hockey rink here and build 67 stories of condo above.....the end result will be +/- 80 stories, it would attract local developers and cash and it would bring that second NHL team to the GTA.
There, done, now I can move on and solve that airport rail link issue over the transportation forums
(<------that guy means I am kidding)vultur09
Banned
There is an opportunity to solve a lot of the city's issues and merge a bunch of threads on UT together making life easier for the mods.
Build a hockey rink here and build 67 stories of condo above.....the end result will be +/- 80 stories, it would attract local developers and cash and it would bring that second NHL team to the GTA.
There, done, now I can move on and solve that airport rail link issue over the transportation forums
^ preferable to the vertical Woodbridge banquet hall designs presented by some of the more well known developers in the region.
Hypnotoad
Senior Member
Shady's back, tell a friend.
casaguy
Senior Member
I understand how many have a soft spot for Roy's Square (a favourite restaurant owner or dry cleaner or whatever) but it was still nothing more than a painted over alley with cheap white lawn chairs. I'm not sure that it was "better than nothing". I prefer to see a blank canvas here once again.
sunnyraytoronto
Senior Member
A typical construction loan is structured as multiple advances as costs are incurred and is usually just calculated as a percentage of all project costs (land, hard construction costs, soft costs {laywers, consultants, etc) and financing costs) so a "much larger construction loan" would:
a) pay off the land the land loan
b) include within the loan an interest reserve that would be drawn on each month to pay the interest costs of the loan itself until the source of the ultimate repayment of the loan - the closing of the condo and hotel sales- were available.
What I do not understand is how this project gets completed, though. if the the total costs are, say, $500 million and they have $70 million in deposits (assuming they can all be used in the project....not necessarily true) and they have arranged a construction loan of $195 from "BTA" (assuming they are ready/willing/able to fund) then that leaves $235 million short.....that would be an unusually high percentage of equity for a developer to invest in a project!
Lots of people have pointed out the negative aspects of the building shrinking from 80 floors to, what, 67 floors. How about the positive aspects of the guy who bought on the 67 floor thinking he had bought a ho-hum unit in an upper (but not top) floor! Didn't he just win the condo lottery having, now, the premium top floor unit
Bazis is having problems paying the loan payment on a $46 million loan,.... haven't made a payment since December and it's July already! Even the chopped off 1 Bloor East at 67 floors will cost about $542 million in construction costs.
Let's put it in perspective most average working folks can understand,... if someone is having problems making the loan payments on their $46,000 car and haven't made a payment in 7 months,.... what kind of financial institution would be willing to loan them $542,000 to build a house? (Can't choose Lehman Brothers,... they already went bankrupt).
Seriously, who is going to loan Bazis $542 million to construct a building on about $50 million worth of land,... land that's about to be taken away from Bazis in receivership. Which other financial institution wants to go bankrupt?
As for the guy buying on the 67th floor now thinking he's some kind of condo lottery winner,.... he's more like the deer caught staring at the headlight,... as 1 Bloor East will probably get chopped again,... and again,...
How low they go, nobody knows right now,... but I'd be surprise if some financial intitution would actually lend Bazis enough money to build a bungalow at that site! - Status