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Transit Secrets: Learning From Hong Kong

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Transit Secrets: Learning From Hong Kong


August 5, 2011

By Alex Marshall

Read More: http://citiwire.net/post/2871/


There is really no denying that transportation makes money. Just consider the huge shopping malls perched around interstate off-ramps, the office parks positioned close to airports, the skyscrapers next to subway stations. But transportation itself is usually a money loser. We pour billions of public dollars into highways, airports and transit systems, while others, the home builders, the department store mavens, make the money that comes slows from those public investments. Hong Kong’s metro system, MTR, has changed this equation, and that is why it’s worth looking at.

- The answer is that Hong Kong’s MTR doesn’t let private developers be the only ones that perch next to its stations. It builds its homes, offices and stores. In short, MTR acts as a real estate developer and business company, as well as a train operator. It owns, among other things, 12 shopping malls built around its stations. These properties and businesses produce substantial cash, which keep the transit agency as a whole in the black.

- Hong Kong’s MTR is unusual in also actually making money from its fares as well. How it can do this relates in part the uniqueness of running trains on an intense few strips of land filled with development. But for our purposes it’s worth looking at its actions as a developer, and that as a model for transportation agencies and departments in this country.

- By many standards, MTR is an unusual company. The MTR only began service in 1979. But once cash was flowing (through development around stations), the government “graduated†MTR to become a private company, still majority owned by government, so that it could raise funding through capital markets and more nimbly enter into joint ventures with private investors.

- Could transit and highway departments in the United States ever do something equally innovative? Why shouldn’t a highway department make money on the shopping malls built around its exits? Shouldn’t it at least get a cut? While it may seem extraordinary to have a transit company operating like a profit-making company, it’s not novel. A century ago private streetcar lines made money more on the homes and shops built around their tracks, on company-owned land, than the nickel fares they received.

- Let me be clear here. I don’t want the transit agencies or highway departments to be only concerned with making a profit for their shareholders, which is how private businesses act. I want them to make a profit for the public, so that roads can be maintained well, taxes and fares kept down.

.....
 
Though I'm not advocating this, the TTC's 80%+ fare recovery very strongly suggests that if it paid its workers minimum wage, eliminated a handful of high-cost routes and automated some processes, it could make a consistent profit. I don't think making money should be an objective, however, and I think that we should even accept a modest drop in fare recovery in order to make the service more comfortable and affordable.

The development story, on the other hand, is a fiasco. The TTC has now been planning to sell the Eglinton bus terminal site for redevelopment through three property booms. How can it possibly take that long to sell a plot of land to developers? If there's something that hasn't quite been worked out about future construction, just keep a large enough envelope to accommodate all possibilities.
 
It could be a Sheppard extension solution. Having the TTC itself build most of the condos, office space, street level retail and stuff on Sheppard and list the TTC on the TSE as well.

Adding things like large college campuses along the route can also give more people reason to travel on the new line and bring the supporting and supplementary businesses to those locations also.
 
Pushing development to justify extending an underused subway is the worst sort of planning.

+1..I for one am all for putting transit in before development, but blatantly densifying just to justify a subway is ludicris!
 
It could be a Sheppard extension solution. Having the TTC itself build most of the condos, office space, street level retail and stuff on Sheppard and list the TTC on the TSE as well.

Considering the fiasco of the TTC's attempts to merely sell land, I can't imagine them actually developing a building. Taking an ownership stake along with an experienced development partner could certainly work, though.

Adding things like large college campuses along the route can also give more people reason to travel on the new line and bring the supporting and supplementary businesses to those locations also.

Absolutely. Wherever possible, all large employment centres and destinations should be located along a rapid transit line, including regional rail corridors that will hopefully soon host rapid transit service.

Pushing development to justify extending an underused subway is the worst sort of planning.

That's ludicrous. First of all, the Sheppard subway isn't underused. It's as well-used as countless other rapid transit lines around the world. A line doesn't have to be at a constant crush load to be well-used. In fact, being at a constant crush load is a bad thing. Secondly, I can't imagine a better place for development than along a rapid transit line, especially one with spare capacity. Should development instead be directed away from rapid transit lines that transit geeks don't like?
 
During the afternoon I did see B-D equivalent occupancy on the Sheppard trains for that given time of day even though it's just 4 cars and not 6, and can do better if it serviced a longer route.

Having the TTC act as a real estate developer along a potential DRL route can make more sense I suppose.
 
Pushing development to justify extending an underused subway is the worst sort of planning.

+1..I for one am all for putting transit in before development, but blatantly densifying just to justify a subway is ludicris!

Erm, what?? Here I thought UrbanToronto was all about Transit-Oriented Development? i.e. it being the only possible justification for the Vaughan portion of the TYSSE.

This is the first I've heard of anyone being against development to support transit. Frankly, it sounds rather ridiculous and NIMBYish.
 
Pushing development to justify extending an underused subway is the worst sort of planning.

+1..I for one am all for putting transit in before development, but blatantly densifying just to justify a subway is ludicris!

What the...

Good planning is encouraging development that supports better transit. But you say cities shouldn't be planned with better transit in mind? Crazy.
 
And good planning is supporting better transit where the current transit is lacking as well, and not to overlook that need when it comes to expanding into new outlying areas.

Anyway another option is the TTC just owning the new land where developers are free to develop what they want and own what they created but would have to pay the TTC a land lease forever and ever and ever producing a significant stream of revenue throughout the city.
 
What the...

Good planning is encouraging development that supports better transit. But you say cities shouldn't be planned with better transit in mind? Crazy.

What a joke. This has nothing to do with encouraging development to support better transit. You guys are just obsessed with extending this useless subway line, and justifying paying for it with super high-density. It's you guys who are crazy. You build subways where there is demand, not because you want to attempt to satisfy some fantasy TOD dream. Have you not seen the traffic mess on Sheppard? How's TOD working for you in that corridor? I love how empty Bayview is during the peak hours.
 
True. There would have to be an expansion of downtown options to relieve the already existing system first, especially if expanding the network to spread out more is in the cards.

But to augment the system for the TTC to start making real estate money in the process and as an ongoing source of revenue.
 
What a joke. This has nothing to do with encouraging development to support better transit. You guys are just obsessed with extending this useless subway line, and justifying paying for it with super high-density. It's you guys who are crazy. You build subways where there is demand, not because you want to attempt to satisfy some fantasy TOD dream. Have you not seen the traffic mess on Sheppard? How's TOD working for you in that corridor? I love how empty Bayview is during the peak hours.


Encouraging high density to support subway not obsession. Being opposed to high density to prevent subway expansion is obesssion. The only joke here is you.
 
Encouraging high density to support subway not obsession. Being opposed to high density to prevent subway expansion is obesssion. The only joke here is you.

Agreed. I guess all this talk of TOD is really just a joke when you don't support it on a line you have a hate-on for. (you=not you doady)
 
Intensifying a corridor to pay for an underused subway is NOT TOD. You guys are like a cult. You believe you are for TOD, when you just want this subway built. You can have TOD with Transit City, you guys were hell-bent against that plan. I have walked around some high density condo areas, and they are not exactly the most pedestrianly friendly places. It's quite shocking really.

But hey, keep on believing you're all for some fantasy where everyone wants to live in super-high density towers just to justify a subway. A corridor of high density towers in a low density area is just ludicrous, It has nothing to with NIMBYism. You just want to achieve your planning fantasy in an area that is not suitable for such density.
 
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