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Post: NY group flunks Toronto's waterfront

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N.Y. group flunks T.O. waterfront
Adds it to 'Hall of Shame'


Condo towers cut off Toronto's waterfront, a N.Y.-based group says.


Dave McGinn, National Post
Published: Friday, August 04, 2006

Toronto's waterfront has just been put in the same class as Brooklyn Bridge Park in Brooklyn, N.Y., Exchange Square in Manchester, England, and the Place de la Concorde in Paris.

But Torontonians and the urban planners who have had a hand in designing the waterfront may want to hold off on boasting -- like these public spaces around the world, a New York-based organization yesterday added Toronto's waterfront to its "Hall of Shame."

"Toronto is a city of great diversity, great civic pride and social life, but that's not apparent when you look at the waterfront," says Ethan Kent, vice-president of Project for Public Spaces, a non-profit urban planning and design organization.

Mr. Kent, who runs the organization's Great Cities Initiative, criticized the "narrow approach to planning and the commercial development that has not taken the opportunity to create special public spaces" on Toronto's waterfront.

Election to the group's Hall of Shame is based on access, comfort, usage and activities and sociability.

"Once you start to look at it through that lens, you start to see where its strengths and weaknesses are," Mr. Kent said.

The waterfront's main weakness, according to the organization, is that it is dominated by privately owned commercial space.

"Private development has resulted in a barrier of condo high-rises, which blocks the view of the water from the rest of Toronto and creates a psychological barrier for the general public," reads a description of the waterfront on the organization's Web site.

"The best waterfronts are the places that bring out all aspects of a city," said Mr. Kent, who cited Vancouver's Granville Island as his organization's favourite waterfront in the world. "It works for locals and for tourists; it has a lot of income-generating things but at the same time those things are part of a larger public vision for that space," he said.

The Toronto Waterfront Revitalization Corporation agrees that some of the Project for Public Space's criticisms are valid, but says its plans for the waterfront are based on balancing commercial and recreational interests, as the New York organization recommends.

"The condominium buildings in the Harbourfront area and the central waterfront aren't what we want to replicate," said Kristin Jenkins, vice-president of communications for the corporation, a group established by the federal government, the province of Ontario and the city in 2001 to oversee the waterfront's renewal.

"One of our key objectives is to open up the waterfront and give it back to the people of Toronto, and the way to do that is to create a significant and spectacular public realm," Ms. Jenkins said.

"The public needs to be able to get down to the water and enjoy it and be able to walk across it and experience it. Right now, it's quite constrained," she added.

Plans to build parks and a promenade that will connect the central waterfront from one end to the other will help make the waterfront accessible, she said.

Still, with completion of the waterfront revitalization not expected for another 25 to 30 years, the Project for Public Spaces fears planning may be outpaced by private development.

"Condos are being thrown up every week it seems," said Project for Public Spaces vice-president Cynthia Nikitin. "You'll have all these buildings and then when you want public space all the decisions will have been made and it'll be too late."
 
The FDR and West Side highway do amazing wonders to long stretches of prime Manhattan waterfront.

:lol


I guess it takes on to know one.
 
I think there is a post regarding PPS' take on the waterfront awhile ago, with the said members also giving a score of zero to Nathan Phillips Square.

In any event, the org. in question seems very into kitsch and historicalism.

AoD
 
Exactly! Has NYC even looked at its own waterfront, its nothing. Ours is better in my view.
 
Yeesh... they're from NYC, it's not as if the city of New York as a whole has come along and criticised us. Have they ever claimed that NY's waterfront is perfect, or that it's even an example?

It dissapoints me when Albertans write off people and ideas simply because they originate from Toronto, and it disssapoints me just the same when my fellow Torontonians feel they can do the same about NY.
 
^Yeah. They're just based in NYC, but they aren't "speaking for NYC" or "sharing NYC's opinion on Toronto".

There are somethings about PPS i don't so much agree with, and some I do, but the state of NY's waterfront has nothing to do with their opinion.
 
Just because PPS can be sometimes be a little too astringent in their judgment (eg. their flunking of NPS) doesn't mean they're totally off base, let along merely "retro" or "nostalgic" in outlook. That said, I *can* see them being co-opted by the urban-reactionary-right-of-centre, like John Sewell vis-a-vis Save Our St Clair...
 
The waterfront's main weakness, according to the organization, is that it is dominated by privately owned commercial space.

Rouge Park, Bluffers Park, The Bluffs, Qew Beach, Ashbridges Bay Park, The Spit, Cherry Beach, The Islands, most of Harbourfront, Music Garden, upcoming H2O and Canada Square, Ontario Place/CNE, Sunnyside, Humber Bay and beyond. All parkland in one form or another and owned by the public. The only condos on the water are around Yonge and maybe around Bathurst. Is the definition of "the waterfront's main weakness" just defined by the stretch between Yonge and York? Pure crap.
 
I've just been to Chicago, where you can't access the water downtown, except at Navy Pier - the yacht clubs and Lake Shore Drive block it, though they have beautiful parks between LSD and the built up core.

Toronto needs to fix its downtown waterfront, I agree (no shooting the messenger here) but its starting to get the attention it needs, and compared to other cities, our waterfront is fairly accessible, and will become even more so. We've got the islands and the Beaches, as well as "naturalized" waterfronts that make it accessible and increasingly well utilized.
 
"Is the definition of "the waterfront's main weakness" just defined by the stretch between Yonge and York? Pure crap."

There's nothing wrong with the stretch from Bay to York...you can totally walk around the condos and they don't "block the view" - a tall shrub would block the view.

If you want to be really critical, the ferry terminal actually kills the waterfront by stopping you dead in your tracks - "Shows over, folks, nothing to see here...but for just $12.00, the waterfront continues on the Islands." It may not matter what they do as all the quays mean there's no continuous stretch of waterfront longer than about 200 metres, which will keep the waterfront fragmented.

Halifax's waterfront looks somewhat similar due to all the piers, resulting in an equally crenallated waterfront, but there's just such a tangible difference between being forced inland to go around a quay versus strolling out into the water to walk along a pier. Queens Quay also meets right up against the quays, reducing them to, at best, individual parkettes. Might as well build condos on them and develop a Chicago-style waterfront out in the Portlands because that's the only place it'll fit without razing everything south of the Gardiner down to the water table.
 
"Private development has resulted in a barrier of condo high-rises, which blocks the view of the water from the rest of Toronto ...
I quite honestly don't understand this statement and many people seem to make it.

Any building blocks the view for some other view behind it. If Scotia Plaza, FCP, and the rest of the Mint were removed then towers at Bloor would have a much improved view of the water.

When Torontonians mention this I assume they're disappointed over their lost view but what exactly are visitors complaining about, the lack of a water view while driving on Gardiner?
 
Agree with cd142. This attitude of defending Toronto at all cost is pathetic, and a sure sign of an inferiority complex.
 

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