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Michael Moore: Letter to "I Am A War President!"

Re: Michael Moore: Letter to "I Am A War President!&am

Now ignoring all the political and personal issues involved here, do you really think that Iraqis were better off under Saddam?

During Saddams reign 30 iraqis (or more) werent dying a day, and as we all know the mass murders took place right after the Gulf War because Bush Sr. told the Iraqis they had US support to stage a revolt, sadly the Americans never showed up, and Saddam killed those against him to regain control.
 
Re: Michael Moore: Letter to "I Am A War President!&am

It remains to be seen whether the next few years for Iraqis are better than their last few years under Saddam's brutal dictatorship. There is no doubt that Saddam was a dictator, brutal to his own people and, frankly, unlikely to be removed without invasion, but now that he is gone, the country risks breakup and, worse, civil war.

Whether or not the U.S. Military should have gone in is one debate, but what the U.S. Military should do now that they are in is an entirely different matter. If Bush lets his attention on Iraq lapse as his did on Afghanistan, or if he tries something especially stupid (like hand over power before the 2004 Presidential election when Iraq is plainly not ready) could result in a bloodbath that dwarfs anything Saddam has done in the past ten years.

...James
 
Re: Michael Moore: Letter to "I Am A War President!&am

And let's not forget the chemical weapons that Saddam used in the 80's against Iran came from the good old USA. Ever seen the picture of Rumsfeld shaking hands with Saddam?
 
Re: Michael Moore: Letter to "I Am A War President!&am

Wait wait wait...

Now ignoring all the political and personal issues involved here, do you really think that Iraqis were better off under Saddam?

Even ignoring the comparative death rates, consider:

- By ignoring UN and world opinion and going into Iraq without just cause, Bush has lived up to the very criticisms and resentments that extremists like Al Qaeda had against the US. He has singlehandedly assured that terrorism will survive and grow in the coming years.
- For those Iraqis who are not suffering from the pain of losing loved ones, there is the ruined infrastructure to deal with, and in many respects there has been no progress since the "end" of the war. The fighting that continues is destroying what little they have left. And this will continue as long as the occupiers remain.
- There will never be peace as long as the occupiers are seen as oppressors.
- The American economy continues to suffer with the increasing billions spent on the war. Those who are suffering most are those who can least afford it, including the soldiers who are dying.

No one liked Saddam. But going into Iraq on the flimsiest excuses (which seem to change daily) has caused lasting damage, and no one knows how long it will take to repair the damage, both physical and political.
 
Re: Michael Moore: Letter to "I Am A War President!&am

This is an article from Al-Jazeera, Im sure its biased, but it does give a glimpse into the other side of the conflict, the Iraqi people and how their lives have been disrupted.

------------------------------------------------------------
Daily dangers on streets of Iraq
By Scott Taylor

Wednesday 11 February 2004, 3:49 Makka Time, 0:49 GMT


The first thing we heard was a short burst of machine-gun fire, followed by the screeching of tyres and several loud thumps.


The incident occurred not more than 40m from the house where I was staying in Baghdad's western suburbs. By the time we grabbed the cameras and rushed to the scene, American soldiers were already deployed around the wreckage of a battered orange and white Toyota pick-up truck.


The windshield was riddled with bullet holes and it was evident that the Toyota had careened off the highway, then ploughed through a chain-link fence before being brought to a stop by a metal lamppost. Steam was still billowing out of the shattered radiator and the driver's bloodied arm hung lifelessly through the open door.


As we approached the crash site, one of the American soldiers spotted my camera and immediately aimed his rifle at me. "Get that camera the hell out of here, or I'll shoot your sorry ass too," he screamed.


I quickly raised the camera over my head to indicate complete compliance, and backed away around the corner. It was obvious that the adrenaline and fear of the American soldiers was at such a high level, that it would be unwise to try to initiate any further discussion.


Only after an ambulance had removed the body and the US detachment had departed did we consider it safe enough to return. About two dozen Iraqi civilian police were swarming all over the scene, collecting evidence and taking photographs. Unlike the American soldiers, the Iraqis were cordial and willing to talk.


"The Americans said that the victim aimed a gun at them as their convoy passed his pick-up truck on the highway," said one policeman, "so it is clearly a matter of self-defence." Tania, a 64-year-old widow living in the house next to the highway, had been in her garden at the time and provided a slightly different eyewitness account.


"The driver had been yelling out his window and shaking his fist at the Americans - when suddenly they shot him," she said. "How could he have had a gun?"


As the US casualty count continues to climb, the occupation troops in Iraq have become increasingly jumpy and less willing to put themselves at risk. Showing me the petrol station close to his home, Anmar Al-Saadi, a former Iraqi soldier, explained how the US Army used to position a tank on the corner to provide security.


"One day last month, an Iraqi resistance sniper shot the tank commander right in the head," Anmar said.


"The Americans shot up the entire apartment building, but they didn't get the sniper. Now they are too afraid to send the tank back here."


The soldiers' rattled nerves and frustration at not being able to contain the guerrillas has resulted in American troops becoming increasingly aggressive in their dealings with the local population.


Nazar, a 38-year-old former employee of the Iraqi foreign ministry and who once served a diplomatic posting in Ottawa, recounted one such incident.


Caught in a typical Baghdad traffic jam, a US soldier had simply used his Hummer's superior weight to push aside Nazar's little Opel. Enraged that the collision had crushed his headlight, Nazar had jumped out of his car to voice a protest.


"Instead of an apology, the soldiers proceeded to shoot out my tyres and windshield," said Nazar. "They laughed and yelled 'Now you can forget about your headlight.'"


American troops are not always so brazen. In another incident we happened to witness, an old taxi was passing by our restaurant when it suddenly burst into flames.


The terrified driver braked to a halt and rushed away from his vehicle. At that moment, a US patrol of three Hummers happened to be passing by. They hastily reversed to a safe distance, fearing that this was a car-bomb intended for them.


Although the shaken Iraqi driver and a number of bystanders stood only metres away from the blaze, the Americans stayed well back.


For the next 20 minutes, my interpreter and I acted as the go-between in order to provide both the driver and the US troops with mutual assurance. The American lieutenant could not be convinced that the car would not explode, but he did guarantee the Iraqi driver that he would not be arrested for carrying black-market fuel.


Another problem plaguing those who venture on to Iraqi highways is the undefined powers and jurisdiction that exist between the US forces and the newly-constituted Iraqi police force.


On the highway south of Kirkuk, Iraqi police had seized a Nissan Pathfinder driven by Jahal Turkan, a 22-year-old pharmacist. "They claim that my registration is a forgery, and took my vehicle without any proof," said Turkan. "But I know they will resell this car before I can return with the paperwork."


Left stranded at the checkpoint with his wife and two small children, Turkan had protested his case to a nearby US patrol. "The soldier laughed at me and said 'Hey, that is what you call freedom,'" said Turkan. "Is it freedom when you give uniforms and guns to thieves?"
 
Re: Michael Moore: Letter to "I Am A War President!&am

There's a lot more evidence suggesting Iraq's chemical weapons came from Germany and Russia than the US.

The US did give Hussein loan guarantees that allowed Iraq to buy weapons, but I haven't seen any evidence that they actually supplied weapons, or even much in the way of dual-use material.

Kevin
 
Re: Michael Moore: Letter to "I Am A War President!&am

I assume you mean the Riegle Report mentiond in the article?

You can find it at www.gulflink.osd.mil/meds..._main.html

The US did ship biological samples to Iraq. They were supposed to be used for medical research, not weapons research. They also shipped the same samples to a lot of other countries, which haven't AFAIK, used them to develop bioweapons.

Kevin
 
Re: Michael Moore: Letter to "I Am A War President!&am

the country risks break-up and, worse, civil war.

sadly this has been part of the plan all along.... it all started with the 3 no-fly zones.... the more a nation is broken up by ethnicity/religion the weaker it is... its also easier for the invaders to find allies, just look at Lebanon in 1982 when Israel found an ally with the Meronitte Christian militias to fight the Palestinian refugees, muslims, and other christians ... or the "Northern Alliance" in Afghanistan to help the Americans.. its all really sad... and has been a colonization and war tactic for hundreds of years
 

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