March 2011 TTC Service Cutbacks

[Jonny5]

From Steve Munro

A notice has appeared at Wilson Division with information apparently taken from the TTC’s Intranet indicating that a proposal for service cutbacks will be at a special TTC meeting on January 12, 2011.

Although I do not have all of the details, it appears that changes made in late 2008 to extend service on all routes until 1:00 am will be rolled back. The changes would take effect with the March 27, 2011 schedules.

If anyone has further info, please leave it as a comment in this thread.

From a budgeting point of view, the full hours of service are low-hanging fruit. Many of the routes operated late at night or on some weekend periods have low ridership, and they are an easy target for cost-cutting. “Fat” some would call it, although there was a bona fide reason for implementing full service.

The problem is that the next time someone wants a budget cut, they will say “see, we told you there was fat, and you cut it so easily in 2011″. Meanwhile what happens for routes where ridership is growing?

Let’s see how this story evolves even though the pols are on vacation

Does it make sense to have bus trundling through Rosedale at 1 am? Probably not, but that one bus will be the much discussed fat to be cut, while dozens of buses on the bone routes across the city get chopped at the same time without discussion.

 

[drum118]

Time to bring in PPP to start running poor ridership routes as well routes with poor cost ratio. Other wise, time to buy a car since Ford is Pro Car in the first place. Maybe we can convince Ford in buying that car for us since it will mean a huge saving at budget time for TTC funding.

 

[W. K. Lis]

From Steve Munro



Does it make sense to have bus trundling through Rosedale at 1 am? Probably not, but that one bus will be the much discussed fat to be cut, while dozens of buses on the bone routes across the city get chopped at the same time without discussion.

Why cutback when the TTC had a surplus in 2010? In 2010, the TTC had saved money by

Lower diesel fuel costs primarily resulting from purchasing at spot market prices for the latter half of this year (2010).

However, in the later part of December, we have seen market prices go up. That means the diesel for the buses will become more expensive. On the other side, gasoline will become even more expensive, resulting in more riders in 2011. If there will be more ridership because of the higher fuel costs, why cutback? Doesn't make sense.

 

[Jonny5]

Why cutback when the TTC had a surplus in 2010? In 2010, the TTC had saved money by However, in the later part of December, we have seen market prices go up. That means the diesel for the buses will become more expensive. On the other side, gasoline will become even more expensive, resulting in more riders in 2011. If there will be more ridership because of the higher fuel costs, why cutback? Doesn't make sense.

I'm sure it will be quickly pointed out that the TTC only had a surplus after the city contributed hundreds of millions. All for union bus drivers getting in the way of my car! Stop the gravy train! etc....

 

[DSC]

No doubt buses running outside of rush hour are less used than those in rush hours but if one removes these late nightor early morning buses you are in danger of forcing people to take a car both to and from work (or social events). An all or none approach will not work but I bet there ARE some off-peak routes that could go amd quite likely some that should be expanded.

 

[allabootmatt]

Who wants to bet that the cutbacks are entirely within the old City, with the outer 416 entirely spared?

 

[whatever]

The old city would be least impacted tho, given that we already have subways past 1:00AM, and adequate Blue Night service

 

[Jonny5]

This isn't about Blue Night service, this is about evening and weekend service.

The changes in November 2008 specifically extended hours of service on 86 routes. Frequencies on 26 routes were increased to a new minimum 30 minutes standard.

 

[taal]

This isn't about Blue Night service, this is about evening and weekend service.

The changes in November 2008 specifically extended hours of service on 86 routes. Frequencies on 26 routes were increased to a new minimum 30 minutes standard.

Right, but it depends exactly what part of this expansion they want to target - or if it is all of it.

A lot of these were relatively minor in the sense that they added 20/30min to the schedule so instead of ending at say 12/12:30 AM they go to 1AM. The minimum 30min frequency also wasn't that signficant for most routes (just about all) as they already run 30min or better even in the worst of times.

The real important question is why - why do they feel the need to save money - I don't think Ford has gotten his hands on the TTC just yet - are they being proactive and assuming the worst ? Is this only the start ... that's they key.

 

[leopetr]

The real important question is why - why do they feel the need to save money - I don't think Ford has gotten his hands on the TTC just yet - are they being proactive and assuming the worst ? Is this only the start ... that's they key.

Ford has said that all city departments will get last year's budget. He's also against fare hikes. Due to the miracle of inflation, that's a ~3% cut in funding. So, TTC will need to cut at least 3% of its service.

 

[Paleo]

From Steve Munro

Does it make sense to have bus trundling through Rosedale at 1 am? Probably not, but that one bus will be the much discussed fat to be cut, while dozens of buses on the bone routes across the city get chopped at the same time without discussion.

If Ford gets his way, all of that fat will be under Sheppard Avenue. If you're going to cut a bus because there's 3 people on it...

 

[W. K. Lis]

If Ford gets his way, all of that fat will be under Sheppard Avenue. If you're going to cut a bus because there's 3 people on it...

Why doesn't Toronto, using the very same arguments, prohibit single-occupant automobiles (excluding commercial vehicles) as another way to cut fat since they are the main cause of traffic congestion.

 

[GenerationW]

Go run for mayor with that as your #1 promise and show me how far you get.

 

[EnviroTO]

So there will be no service cuts to pay for the cancellation of the vehicle registration tax... but there was no mention of a zero property tax amount increase (i.e. rate decrease) so now cutting services is fair game because it wasn't because of the cancelled tax. The TTC is essential service... if its a subway. Streetcars are a waste and buses are only essential when there are more than 10 people on them... for those 5 people riding an off-peak bus it is a luxury perk to choose slower moving transit options when the roads are uncongested. There will be greater transparency... but that transparency will come after it is too late to do anything about the decisions being made. It is becoming clear how this term will work.

 

[allabootmatt]

Here it comes...
''If there is a bus route that just doesn’t make sense and you have to take that out of service, the critics would argue that’s a service cut, but normal people would say it’s losing a ton of money… we’re better off to put an extra bus on Finch Avenue where people are crammed,” said Mr. Del Grande. ''

http://news.nationalpost.com/2010/12/28/rob-fords-to-do-list/

I think normal people would say that's a service cut, actually. And what would normal people say about junking every other transit expansion plan for a subway that will indeed, lose a ton of money?