Toronto 120 Willowdale Avenue | ?m | 9s | Skale | Richard Wengle

3Dementia

Senior Member
Member Bio
Joined
Apr 24, 2007
Messages
3,858
Reaction score
7,119
Interestingly, I just posted the Waterloo mid-rise (chateau ;-) design by Richard Wengle, along with other active projects he has designed in Toronto... over at SSP, and a forum member there found this pic from Skale also designed by Wengle for North York.

Don't know if there's an application in the AIC or not but I'll leave it to the usual suspects/sleuths to source it if it's there. ;)

20240326-144943.jpg

yaletown_fella
 
Last edited:
Interestingly, I just posted the Waterloo mid-rise (chateau ;-) design by Richard Wengle, along with other active projects he has designed in Toronto... over at SSP, and a forum member there found this pic from Skale also designed by Wengle for North York.

Don't know if there's an application in the AIC or not but I'll leave it to the usual suspects/sleuths to source it if it's there. ;)

Wouldn't fit on 120 Willowdale alone:
1711486074387.png


Don't see it on Skale's website.

It is not in the AIC

It is not on Councillor Cheng's website - Development listing page.

So there's only one source left to tap.

Ahem, @sunnyraytoronto
 
@Northern Light So putting on my tapping shoes,...

To build what is rendered, an approximately 250ft X 250ft land-assembly would be required,... every property on this block along west-side of Willowdale Avenue from MapleHurst Ave to Greenfield Ave and 2 adjacent residential houses along each of those streets (pictured enclosed in Yellow box)
120WillowdaleRedXBlue.jpg


Checking property records, there is NO land-assembly here. All the lots are owned by different owners - except one owner owns both 124 & 128 Willowdale Ave (circled in blue).

NOTE: City Planning's Development Application are funny,... in that, you technically do NOT need to own the property to submit a Development Application for that property!!!
- Here, there might be an agreement to sell later on if this Development Application is successful,... or all the separate owners will become partners in the new proposal,... or there's a combination of both!

I walked around the site recently,... and found 6 shiny metal disc covers (marked by Red X in image) used for Core Sample Drilling! There's likely more - covered by parked cars and I didn't check the houses since that's private property not open to public. Well,... prior to an Official Submission for a Development Application (where it becomes public),... it takes about 6 month of discussion with City Planning to submit all the required Reports. That's where this project seems to be now,... Core Drilling is usually done about 1 month in,... and since these metal discs are still shiny, I'm guessing they were done about a month ago,... thus expect an official submission in about 4 months - around July.


Anyways,... Let's assume this is a serious Development Proposal,...
- a sucker might look at this site and see the nearby 9-storey under construction at 181 Sheppard East and think the proposed height would be reasonable here,... but that's site is within the Sheppard-Willowdale Secondary Plan area,... this site (marked with Orange X) is NOT!
SheppardWillowdaleSecondaryPlanOrangeX.jpg


- across Willowdale Ave are 3-storey office buildings (maybe subject to 11m height limit),... since office ceiling heights are about 50% higher than residential condo ceiling height,.. 3-storey office building is equivalent to 4.5-storey residential or maybe 5-storey residential with low ceiling height - that's what would likely be allowable on this site,...
- the Single Residential House Neighbourhood in rear is protected by 45-degree angular plane rule,... so that mean this proposal will have a terrace sloping side towards them! This could also limit the height as well to below 5-storey since the Willowdale Ave lots are only 120ft deep.
- Oh, and the 2 houses along MapleHurst and another 2 houses along Greenfield Ave,... those are in the Single Residential House neighbourhood,.... NOT zoned for Condo! At best, those lots can be used for driveways/service-roads for the condo,...

This sums up the City Planning side,... anything different like this proposal will be rejected by City, of course it could be appealed to OMB/OLT,... and since there's really no precedent for something like this in this area. So likely to lose at OMB/OLT.

And keep in mind this site is NOT within a Transit Hub - well beyond the 500m & 800m from both Sheppard and Bayview Station.
NOTE: When Sheppard STUBway was being designed,... there was proposal to include a Willowdale Subway Station, but locals rejected it since it would bring massive high-density Redevelopment to the area,... so that subway train has left the station long ago!

So what's really going on here,... the "broker" is real-estate agent Shilla Persa,.... who with her husband seems to also operate "Persa Capital Group" out of 120 Willowdale Ave,... which is now looking for suckers,.. err, I mean Partners for this "Northville" project,... this luxurious project - diagonal to a Rona hardware store!
1711649456823.png


Warning: This is NOT a well-known realtor in Willowdale. And I've never even heard of Persa Capital Group!

This project seems to be targetting foreign investor for partnership. There's a lot of money laundering in this area,.... within Yonge corridor of North York, every other Persian/Iranian shop operates a "Money Exchange" in the back - last count is just under 100. A lot of real-estate investor - construction rebuild - buyer,... big suitcase of money, another suitcase of money,.. even some of the big condo projects here are financed by money laundering,...

I'll bet my last dollar this proposal will never be built as rendered!
 
@Northern Light So putting on my tapping shoes,...

To build what is rendered, an approximately 250ft X 250ft land-assembly would be required,... every property on this block along west-side of Willowdale Avenue from MapleHurst Ave to Greenfield Ave and 2 adjacent residential houses along each of those streets (pictured enclosed in Yellow box)
View attachment 551810

Checking property records, there is NO land-assembly here. All the lots are owned by different owners - except one owner owns both 124 & 128 Willowdale Ave (circled in blue).

NOTE: City Planning's Development Application are funny,... in that, you technically do NOT need to own the property to submit a Development Application for that property!!!
- Here, there might be an agreement to sell later on if this Development Application is successful,... or all the separate owners will become partners in the new proposal,... or there's a combination of both!

I walked around the site recently,... and found 6 shiny metal disc covers (marked by Red X in image) used for Core Sample Drilling! There's likely more - covered by parked cars and I didn't check the houses since that's private property not open to public. Well,... prior to an Official Submission for a Development Application (where it becomes public),... it takes about 6 month of discussion with City Planning to submit all the required Reports. That's where this project seems to be now,... Core Drilling is usually done about 1 month in,... and since these metal discs are still shiny, I'm guessing they were done about a month ago,... thus expect an official submission in about 4 months - around July.


Anyways,... Let's assume this is a serious Development Proposal,...
- a sucker might look at this site and see the nearby 9-storey under construction at 181 Sheppard East and think the proposed height would be reasonable here,... but that's site is within the Sheppard-Willowdale Secondary Plan area,... this site (marked with Orange X) is NOT!
View attachment 551811

- across Willowdale Ave are 3-storey office buildings (maybe subject to 11m height limit),... since office ceiling heights are about 50% higher than residential condo ceiling height,.. 3-storey office building is equivalent to 4.5-storey residential or maybe 5-storey residential with low ceiling height - that's what would likely be allowable on this site,...
- the Single Residential House Neighbourhood in rear is protected by 45-degree angular plane rule,... so that mean this proposal will have a terrace sloping side towards them! This could also limit the height as well to below 5-storey since the Willowdale Ave lots are only 120ft deep.
- Oh, and the 2 houses along MapleHurst and another 2 houses along Greenfield Ave,... those are in the Single Residential House neighbourhood,.... NOT zoned for Condo! At best, those lots can be used for driveways/service-roads for the condo,...

This sums up the City Planning side,... anything different like this proposal will be rejected by City, of course it could be appealed to OMB/OLT,... and since there's really no precedent for something like this in this area. So likely to lose at OMB/OLT.

And keep in mind this site is NOT within a Transit Hub - well beyond the 500m & 800m from both Sheppard and Bayview Station.
NOTE: When Sheppard STUBway was being designed,... there was proposal to include a Willowdale Subway Station, but locals rejected it since it would bring massive high-density Redevelopment to the area,... so that subway train has left the station long ago!

So what's really going on here,... the "broker" is real-estate agent Shilla Persa,.... who with her husband seems to also operate "Persa Capital Group" out of 120 Willowdale Ave,... which is now looking for suckers,.. err, I mean Partners for this "Northville" project,... this luxurious project - diagonal to a Rona hardware store!
View attachment 551812

Warning: This is NOT a well-known realtor in Willowdale. And I've never even heard of Persa Capital Group!

This project seems to be targetting foreign investor for partnership. There's a lot of money laundering in this area,.... within Yonge corridor of North York, every other Persian/Iranian shop operates a "Money Exchange" in the back - last count is just under 100. A lot of real-estate investor - construction rebuild - buyer,... big suitcase of money, another suitcase of money,.. even some of the big condo projects here are financed by money laundering,...

I'll bet my last dollar this proposal will never be built as rendered!

TY for that most thorough report! (seriously); I know who to tap for info anywhere near North York Centre!
 
There is a precendent at 181 East Condos at Sheppard Ave E and Willowdale that could lead to OMB approval. Especially with the housing shortage situation.

Are you sure parsa capital group is the developer? I thought there was an agreement for Skale to use them as the listing brokerage to sell the units.

It's odd I didnt see this posted on Richard Wengles Instagram like the Forest Hill Village project.
 
Last edited:

Back
Top