Eglinton East LRT | Metrolinx

[JSF-1]

Stouffille GO and Lakeshore will be near-subways within a few years,

Yea my apologies if I don't believe this part one bit. We've been burned far to many times by Metrolinx to trust that there is any sort of service improvement coming to any GO line in Scarborough or the rest of the GTA for that matter. They have been at it for 10 years and what do they have to show for it? Not a single power sub-station has been built, not a single catenary poll installed, not a single inch of catenary wire strung up, not a single electric vehicle purchased. What they do have to show for it is running off DB through what is arguably borderline sabotage, re-branding RER to some GO 2.0 nonsense, and potentially scaling down the project to "deliver the minimum". I to want my end of the city to have better transit but we need to accept the fact that GO won't be part of that because GO electrification is being handled by an incompetent organization run by pigs with their noses in the trough who are far more content with maintaining the status quo. The future of Scarborough's transit cannot be hitched to the RER wagon when the organization involved with delivering it has fumbled it to such a degree that if electrification ever happens it will be half-assed and a far cry from what was promised 10 years ago.

 

[Northern Light]

Yea my apologies if I don't believe this part one bit. We've been burned far to many times by Metrolinx to trust that there is any sort of service improvement coming to any GO line in Scarborough or the rest of the GTA for that matter. They have been at it for 10 years and what do they have to show for it? Not a single power sub-station has been built, not a single catenary poll installed, not a single inch of catenary wire strung up, not a single electric vehicle purchased. What they do have to show for it is running off DB through what is arguably borderline sabotage, re-branding RER to some GO 2.0 nonsense, and potentially scaling down the project to "deliver the minimum". I to want my end of the city to have better transit but we need to accept the fact that GO won't be part of that because GO electrification is being handled by an incompetent organization run by pigs with their noses in the trough who are far more content with maintaining the status quo. The future of Scarborough's transit cannot be hitched to the RER wagon when the organization involved with delivering it has fumbled it to such a degree that if electrification ever happens it will be half-assed and a far cry from what was promised 10 years ago.

Electrification is not required for the schedules I just stated, 15 minute frequencies for base service, with express on top, is feasible with existing locomotives and rollingstock.

Now if you want sub-10M, that would likely require electrification, and/or DMUs may be feasible.

 

[Thaboss]

So where’s the data supporting this being a worthwhile project that doesn’t take away from other needed lines? If there has ever been a ridership study that showed the Sheppard Subway is required then it would be getting trotted out every chance there is.

Source: City of Toronto https://share.google/qg5NhtHJYgAEkqxCl

Sheppard Subway Extension

Seeking community input to extend rapid transit along Sheppard Avenue both east and west.

www.metrolinx.com

Sheppard line extension is in active development and is undoubtedly going to be more than just studies before the next provincial election would be my guess.

And as a Scarborough resident would absolutly prefer that exstension to malvern over any EELRT assuming that those are the options.

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

Source: City of Toronto https://share.google/qg5NhtHJYgAEkqxCl

Sheppard Subway Extension

Seeking community input to extend rapid transit along Sheppard Avenue both east and west.

www.metrolinx.com

Sheppard line extension is in active development and is undoubtedly going to be more than just studies before the next provincial election would be my guess.

And as a Scarborough resident would absolutly prefer that exstension to malvern over any EELRT assuming that those are the options.

I'll be honest, the subway will be better up to Markham Rd. ridership will drop off past there for sure. But maybe that is enough.

If this was connected to the crosstown full than this is not really a debate.

 

[Monarch Butterfly]

Wonder if consideration has been done to have fewer light rail stops. Effectively making the light rail stops "express" only. Then have a parallel "local" bus taking care of the stops between the "express" light rail stops, with transfer privileges between the "local" and "express" services. Providing that the "local" service has the same headway or frequency as the "express" service.

 

[Voltz]

Source: City of Toronto https://share.google/qg5NhtHJYgAEkqxCl

Sheppard Subway Extension

Seeking community input to extend rapid transit along Sheppard Avenue both east and west.

www.metrolinx.com

Sheppard line extension is in active development and is undoubtedly going to be more than just studies before the next provincial election would be my guess.

And as a Scarborough resident would absolutly prefer that exstension to malvern over any EELRT assuming that those are the options.

The word ridership appears only once in that document, under outstanding items. I don’t know how anyone can pretend this subway has not been pushed for political reasons, and also claim that LRT lines are excessive but no we need this subway.

 

[Thaboss]

The word ridership appears only once in that document, under outstanding items. I don’t know how anyone can pretend this subway has not been pushed for political reasons, and also claim that LRT lines are excessive but no need this subway.

I'm not sure i understand your criticism.

Are you suprised/critiquing the fact that subways in ontario require political will ?

Do you believe expansion of Sheppard line is unjustified?

Do you believe the EELRT would be a better option than the Sheppard line?

 

[Voltz]

I'm not sure i understand your criticism.

Are you suprised/critiquing the fact that subways in ontario require political will ?

Do you believe expansion of Sheppard line is unjustified?

Do you believe the EELRT would be a better option than the Sheppard line?

The Sheppard Subway has never been supported by sufficient ridership level projections to justify its construction or expansion, and there continues to be no such projections.

It is only being pushed now for political reasons, just like it always has been. It has also been a drain on transit expansion for a long time, preventing other projects from moving forward, and the Scarborough Subway has also done that and waste many billions that could have built several other lines.

But Line 7 is being criticized on here as a waste by some who also think the Sheppard Subway out to Morningside is a good idea, an area of Sheppard that is lined with the backyards of single detached homes, make that make sense.

I don’t agree with the need for Line 7 on Sheppard, that was also only pushed to make up for the Scarborough LRT to Malvern being cancelled, but I’m fine with the rest of it.

 

[Rainforest]

The Sheppard Subway has never been supported by sufficient ridership level projections to justify its construction or expansion, and there continues to be no such projections.

It is only being pushed now for political reasons, just like it always has been. It has also been a drain on transit expansion for a long time, preventing other projects from moving forward, and the Scarborough Subway has also done that and waste many billions that could have built several other lines.

But Line 7 is being criticized on here as a waste by some who also think the Sheppard Subway out to Morningside is a good idea, an area of Sheppard that is lined with the backyards of single detached homes, make that make sense.

I don’t agree with the need for Line 7 on Sheppard, that was also only pushed to make up for the Scarborough LRT to Malvern being cancelled, but I’m fine with the rest of it.

The subway's passenger volume may be low, but it definitely improves the travel time. No surprise the residents want subway.

On the other hand, LRT seriously underperformed on Finch, the travel times got worse during much of the day except the busiest hours. No wonder that few residents want to put up with years of construction, if the resulting transit will be no faster than the buses they already have.

LRT serving Eglinton and Kingston Rd might still be a good idea if the future demand volume exceeds the level that can be comfortably handled by buses. But, most of people do not think that far into the future. The only way to make LRT popular again, is to fix the operation on Finch and prove that LRT can be fast.

Speaking of Sheppard Subway, extending it to Morningside is hardly a good idea. That subway should either get to McCowan and stop there, or swing south of the 401 and serve the area that at least has 2 destinations: Centennial College and UTSC.

 

[nfitz]

On the other hand, LRT seriously underperformed on Finch, the travel times got worse during much of the day except the busiest hours.

You keep saying this, and it keeps getting pointed out to you that this isn't true, beyond a handful of anecdotal observations during early operations last year.

Even with the non-final LRT 46-minute times last year, the LRT was faster than the bus at most times. Since then travel times have dropped to 44 minutes at peak to as low as 42 minutes in late evening, and weekends.

And they still aren't at the final speeds! Please stop gaslighting us.

 

[Rainforest]

You keep saying this, and it keeps getting pointed out to you that this isn't true, beyond a handful of anecdotal observations during early operations last year.

Even with the non-final LRT 46-minute times last year, the LRT was faster than the bus at most times. Since then travel times have dropped to 44 minutes at peak to as low as 42 minutes in late evening, and weekends.

And they still aren't at the final speeds! Please stop gaslighting us.

View attachment 732216

Nov. 2025 is the period when the construction was not entirely finished, and that could cause additional delays for the bus. A more sensible comparison would be against the bus travel time before the construction started.

Anyway, 42 min travel time for the 10.7 km LRT route, means 15.3 kph average speed. That's not a pattern that will inspire many residents. If you want active support for LRT, need to reach at least 20 kph, better 25 kph.

At 15 kph, the best you can expect is indifference. They will take it if the city builds it, but will not vote or create petitions to push for the LRT.

 

[nfitz]

Anyway, 42 min travel time for the 10.7 km LRT route, means 15.3 kph average speed. That's not a pattern that will inspire many residents. If you want active support for LRT, need to reach at least 20 kph, better 25 kph.

42 minutes isn't the final travel time. Metrolinx was publishing 33 minutes early on ... about 19.5 km/hr.

Let's just wait and see ...

 

[urbanclient]

Nov. 2025 is the period when the construction was not entirely finished, and that could cause additional delays for the bus. A more sensible comparison would be against the bus travel time before the construction started.

Anyway, 42 min travel time for the 10.7 km LRT route, means 15.3 kph average speed. That's not a pattern that will inspire many residents. If you want active support for LRT, need to reach at least 20 kph, better 25 kph.

At 15 kph, the best you can expect is indifference. They will take it if the city builds it, but will not vote or create petitions to push for the LRT.

I'm a big Line 6 hater, begrudgingly accepting it's existence due to it being a rare example of future proofing (current ridership and pop. density don't warrant a tram, much less a subway). However there seems to be hope for Line 6, see below:

Report on my Line 6 ride today after 7pm:

- Acceleration and braking were much more aggresive than a month ago, maybe even more so than on Line 5. The drivers seemed to be gunning it and we constantly hit 55-60km/h.
- TSP was there but it seems the timing was not adjusted to the improved schedule: we just missed the light a few times and needed to wait for the whole light cycle.
- 35km/h at intersections and 25km/h at stations.
- We came to a crawl at 5km/h west of Pearldale and stopped at Rowntree Mills station for more than a minute. We slowed again just before Martin Grove. I guess there is a slow zone in place west bound.
- Ride quality was fine on the westbound train but much worse on another eastbound train.
- Total travel time westbound from Finch West to Humber college was ~35 minutes including the slow down. Eastbound from Stevenson to Finch West was ~23 minutes.

Great improvents overall and I think it is realistic to get the line under 30 minutes if they lift the speed restrictions and fine tune the TSP.

Assuming the 35 minutes is true, that means Line 6's best case average speeds are getting close to Paris' T9 tram. Which apparently ranges from 32 to 36 minutes for the same 10.3 km distance.

That's not to say I am supportive of the current iteration of Line 7 plans.

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

The subway's passenger volume may be low, but it definitely improves the travel time. No surprise the residents want subway.

On the other hand, LRT seriously underperformed on Finch, the travel times got worse during much of the day except the busiest hours. No wonder that few residents want to put up with years of construction, if the resulting transit will be no faster than the buses they already have.

LRT serving Eglinton and Kingston Rd might still be a good idea if the future demand volume exceeds the level that can be comfortably handled by buses. But, most of people do not think that far into the future. The only way to make LRT popular again, is to fix the operation on Finch and prove that LRT can be fast.

Speaking of Sheppard Subway, extending it to Morningside is hardly a good idea. That subway should either get to McCowan and stop there, or swing south of the 401 and serve the area that at least has 2 destinations: Centennial College and UTSC.

I agree, but they have decided to bring the Bloor Danforth Extension to McCowan. That complicates a lot of things. It should just go to STC but this is Toronto...

 

[KhalilHeron]

The Sheppard Subway has never been supported by sufficient ridership level projections to justify its construction or expansion, and there continues to be no such projections.

It is only being pushed now for political reasons, just like it always has been. It has also been a drain on transit expansion for a long time, preventing other projects from moving forward, and the Scarborough Subway has also done that and waste many billions that could have built several other lines.

But Line 7 is being criticized on here as a waste by some who also think the Sheppard Subway out to Morningside is a good idea, an area of Sheppard that is lined with the backyards of single detached homes, make that make sense.

I don’t agree with the need for Line 7 on Sheppard, that was also only pushed to make up for the Scarborough LRT to Malvern being cancelled, but I’m fine with the rest of it.

The Sheppard subways ridership may be low by Toronto standards but for the continent its pretty solid. That's even before any extensions.

Heres the Weekday Ridership per km for bunch of heavy rail systems
TTC Line 1 & 2 (2023-24) - 15.9k
Montreal Metro (2025) - 14.1k
MTA Subway (route length, 2025) - 9.4k
TTC Line 4 (2023-24) - 7.0k
Skytrain (2025) - 5.5k
MBTA RL, BL, & OL (2025) - 5.4k
Septa L & B (2023) - 4.6k
Chicago L (2025) - 2.5k
Washington Metro (2025) - 2.1k

line 4 does doesn't do too bad for itself...