Toronto Ontario Place: New Science Centre | 4s | Province of Ontario | Snøhetta + HPA

[generalcanada]

Actually, Ford said that the city can do anything it wants with the property, except open another science centre.

There is a 20-year suggested repair plan for the building that costs tens of millions of dollars per year at most; it's variable, not hundreds of millions of dollars in years 1 to 3 like for the new build at Ontario Place.

right but they still removed everything from inside. there was that fake business case that still said the exhibits needs revamping at the cost of like 200 million.
Personally I dont have a care for it one way or another. if the city really wants to do it, they bettter make it better than whats going to open here at ontario place

 

[taal]

right but they still removed everything from inside. there was that fake business case that still said the exhibits needs revamping at the cost of like 200 million.
Personally I dont have a care for it one way or another. if the city really wants to do it, they bettter make it better than whats going to open here at ontario place

Side note, I doubt this was a fake business case ... for those that have visited the science in recent times - many of the exhibits were ancient - and there was near zero effort made to update them.

So honestly I could buy 200M ... but a small fraction of that would be on the roof and it's still a much much lower cost than building a newer science center.


Comeon though ... why do people keep bringing up the existing Science center and the nonsensical arguments made to rationalize the move ... we know what Ford wanted, he wanted to leave a "legacy" at Ontario place ... so the spa + a science center were exactly how he planned on doing so.

 

[rdaner]

Curious as to how the centre is integrated with streetscape. Are there plans yet? Is there a large space on the ground floor to act as a venue? Theatre? And a little disappointed with the bridge proposal! Maybe something a little more innovative?!

 

[grammin]

A link to the images and a few more:

Dropbox

www.dropbox.com

View attachment 717579

Yikes I'm terrified that the happy looking cyclist, who is eyeing a relaxing saunter across the crosswalk, is about to be mowed down by the speedy red car approaching. Who thought it was a good idea to render the cars in fast motion?

 

[nightstreak]

Interestingly... it has also vanished from the project website and is no longer labeled on the overall plan as well. https://www.ontario.ca/page/final-designs-ontario-place
Previous:
View attachment 717631
Current:
View attachment 717632

Those responsible for the graphics aren’t getting their facts straight. That’s not the Science Centre that’s circled in this:

And in the graphic shown, that’s also not the current Therme, Amphitheatre and Science Centre designs so I wouldn’t read too much into it.

 

[hawc]

For comparison's sake...

 

[hawc]

I know this thread is about the new Science Centre, but allow me one last reminisce about the real one...

The first time I took my son to the Science Centre he was just 3 years old. He ran across the bridge (that would close 'for repairs' forever a few months later) and ran his hand along the textured vertically grooved concrete walls before we headed down the escalators. We ended up going nearly twice a month for the next four years. We both absolutely adored it and for some reason never got tired of it. I told him one day when he was older we'd ride to it up the Don Bike Path from our home downtown. When he was 7 years old we finally did it. We rode up, locked our bikes outside, went in for a few hours and rode home. Four days later the fences went up and it closed forever.

 

[thaivic]

For comparison's sake...


View attachment 718138

Owning my own GC company since 1987 i can say from my own experience that $100,000.00 build in 1987 could not be done for $800.000.00 today. Construction cost adjusted to inflation doesn't work very well in the construction industry.
What you could build in 1969 for $30M cannot be built today for $250M not even close.

 

[NY99]

Owning my own GC company since 1987 i can say from my own experience that $100,000.00 build in 1987 could not be done for $800.000.00 today. Construction cost adjusted to inflation doesn't work very well in the construction industry.
What you could build in 1969 for $30M cannot be built today for $250M not even close.

I’m still not super clear on why this is. Tightening labour/safety laws leading to more spent on liability prevention? Labour shortage leading to higher wages? Productivity declines because everyone’s on their phones?

Regarding the former, I work in the health & safety space, witha ton of GC clients, and I can tell you, our overall regulatory system has gotten increasingly litigious. Companies are now spending money for people like us when they never used to.

 

[thaivic]

I’m still not super clear on why this is. Tightening labour/safety laws leading to more spent on liability prevention? Labour shortage leading to higher wages? Productivity declines because everyone’s on their phones?

Regarding the former, I work in the health & safety space, witha ton of GC clients, and I can tell you, our overall regulatory system has gotten increasingly litigious. Companies are now spending money for people like us when they never used to.

It's all of the above.

 

[jje1000]

Side note, I doubt this was a fake business case ... for those that have visited the science in recent times - many of the exhibits were ancient - and there was near zero effort made to update them.

So honestly I could buy 200M ... but a small fraction of that would be on the roof and it's still a much much lower cost than building a newer science center.


Comeon though ... why do people keep bringing up the existing Science center and the nonsensical arguments made to rationalize the move ... we know what Ford wanted, he wanted to leave a "legacy" at Ontario place ... so the spa + a science center were exactly how he planned on doing so.

Ironically I think many of their ancient exhibits were much better than their newer post-00s ones- for one thing I miss the OSC's old transportation section with the carved out steam train and minatures.

And the old Science Arcade was very much a nostalgic time capsule of 70s exhibit design that could have simply done well with some newer signage.

 

[CapitalSeven]

Actually, Ford said that the city can do anything it wants with the property, except open another science centre.

There is a 20-year suggested repair plan for the building that costs tens of millions of dollars per year at most; it's variable, not hundreds of millions of dollars in years 1 to 3 like for the new build at Ontario Place.

The City could turn the old Science Centre into the Toronto Museum of Old Dilapidated Heritage Buildings We Can't Tear Down But Can't Think Of Anything To Do With Either. Old City Hall. Several silos. What am I forgetting?

 

[narduch]

The City could turn the old Science Centre into the Toronto Museum of Old Dilapidated Heritage Buildings We Can't Tear Down But Can't Think Of Anything To Do With Either. Old City Hall. Several silos. What am I forgetting?

We could put the Honest Ed's sign there too

 

[reinventingthewheel]

The City could turn the old Science Centre into the Toronto Museum of Old Dilapidated Heritage Buildings We Can't Tear Down But Can't Think Of Anything To Do With Either. Old City Hall. Several silos. What am I forgetting?

Union train shed. Though I’ve heard if it did get removed, it could be sent to Winnipeg.

 

[Natika33]

The City could turn the old Science Centre into the Toronto Museum of Old Dilapidated Heritage Buildings We Can't Tear Down But Can't Think Of Anything To Do With Either. Old City Hall. Several silos. What am I forgetting?

Waaay off topic, but there was a museum/photo studio of neon lights that closed a few years back that I think could be expanded & brought back for reals in the old Ontario Science Centre building or part of it (with the Honest Ed sign there too as narduch suggested). Could be fun & a wee bit unique. See blogTO article on the old one here:
https://share.google/G1AmC49kOtsx9hMPt