TTC: Electric and alternative fuel buses

[cplchanb]

M

Its almost like they are using the emergency brake application to stop at a bus stop, imagine a person who is injured or disabled trying to hold on for dear life?

I was sitting in a row of 3 and it knocked me over one seat because they brake so.hard.

Most drivers probably dont know how to brake an e bus probably and are just using old bus muscle memory. There probably is no driver conversion training other than controls famil

 

[turini2]

I'm actually surprised there sticking with this EV agenda, when everyone appears to be backing away from it.

[citation needed]

• NYC has a target of 2040 for a 100% ZE fleet, with over 80 electric buses in service and nearly 1,400 on order
• London will have a 100% ZE fleet by 2034, over 2,000 electric buses in service
• Moscow has over 2,500 electric buses in service
• Paris has over 1,100 electric buses in service

No, transit agencies are not "backing away" from it

 

[PL1]

M

Most drivers probably dont know how to brake an e bus probably and are just using old bus muscle memory. There probably is no driver conversion training other than controls famil

I have seen that the type of bus I get the same time each morning is the same, but the driver is the same. It probably takes a bit to get used to the change in brake (and acceleration) sensitivity. I notice this each time I get a new Zipcar. Of course, some drivers are less gentle...

 

[Steve X]

M

Most drivers probably dont know how to brake an e bus probably and are just using old bus muscle memory. There probably is no driver conversion training other than controls famil

It’s much easier if they never drove a gasoline/diesel car before. However an all electric generation growing up is still decades away. It will still be difficult if they will have to drive a diesel bus and a gas car to get to work.

 

[APTA-2048]

Interesting development at PhoenixEV (formerly Proterra).

We have been working very hard at PhoenixEV to get legacy Proterra EV buses back in service. Some great success stories already at Harvard University, QC MetroLINK, Duke University, Charleston Area… | John Walsh

We have been working very hard at PhoenixEV to get legacy Proterra EV buses back in service. Some great success stories already at Harvard University, QC MetroLINK, Duke University, Charleston Area Regional Transportation Authority, The University of Georgia, Chicago Transit Authority and...

www.linkedin.com

We have been working very hard at PhoenixEV to get legacy Proterra EV buses back in service. Some great success stories already at Harvard University, QC MetroLINK, Duke University, Charleston Area Regional Transportation Authority, The University of Georgia, Chicago Transit Authority and Spokane Transit. This past week we completed training at Duke University after a successful delivery of 4 brand new ZX5 buses in October and also a successful battery replacement with the great team at Harvard University. We could not do any of this without our partnership with Powers Parts. Please see this announcement between PhoenixEV and Powers Parts on this great collaboration.

Apparently talks are happening with the TTC too.

 

[Bordercollie]

Interesting development at PhoenixEV (formerly Proterra).

We have been working very hard at PhoenixEV to get legacy Proterra EV buses back in service. Some great success stories already at Harvard University, QC MetroLINK, Duke University, Charleston Area… | John Walsh

We have been working very hard at PhoenixEV to get legacy Proterra EV buses back in service. Some great success stories already at Harvard University, QC MetroLINK, Duke University, Charleston Area Regional Transportation Authority, The University of Georgia, Chicago Transit Authority and...

www.linkedin.com

Apparently talks are happening with the TTC too.

Are the batteries the actual problem?

 

[afransen]

Wondering if we should be importing Chinese BEV buses... they seem to have deployed a lot of them.

 

[Bordercollie]

Wondering if we should be importing Chinese BEV buses... they seem to have deployed a lot of them.

We did and they are all out of service

 

[APTA-2048]

Are the batteries the actual problem?

I’m not sure the specifics, but it could be any number of unique parts they haven’t been able to source.

Wondering if we should be importing Chinese BEV buses... they seem to have deployed a lot of them.

Might be a quantity over quality thing. The few agencies who bought BYD buses in Canada have had less than ideal experiences with them. TTC’s might actually be the most successful. But as stated above, they are all currently out of service.

 

[Bordercollie]

I’m not sure the specifics, but it could be any number of unique parts they haven’t been able to source.



Might be a quantity over quality thing. The few agencies who bought BYD buses in Canada have had less than ideal experiences with them. TTC’s might actually be the most successful. But as stated above, they are all currently out of service.

I do see the York university shuttle here and there. Has that been reliable? But that's different from doing 200km per day 3-4 days a week to 500 every day 6-7 days per week.

 

[CMQSD402F9011]

It appears that TTC once looked into expanding trolleybus service on Bathurst and Dufferin in the early 1980s, but never came to fruition. By now it would cost millions to bring back trolleybuses in Toronto, unless the provincial and federal governments chip in

 

[RapidTransit]

I mean , the biggest road block to trolleys would be the actual facilities.

I assume the overhead wires would be the same as what the streetcars use? Actually streetcars use panto, so no. But we do have the overhead department at TTC.

I remember David Miller was studying to bring back trolleybuses in 2009. I wonder if a report actually came out from it. Either way, Rob Ford came in a year later.

Also, the same company that made the last trolley buses TTC had are still around today, NFI, and they still make trolley buses today. I can only imagine the improvement in technology and off during capabilities. NFI is also Canadian, fully Canadian too.

But to be honest , with the amount of traffic we have and the road designs that don't help bigger vehicles navigate the downtown area, and then to still follow a overhead wire will be annoying for operators. I get the nostalgic behind it, and love that it's actually proven technology, I just don't think it would be practical to have them.

TTC can't even get a bus garage in the old former city of Toronto, much less a garage for trolleybuses.

It would be interesting to see how things would have played out if TTC kept they're trolleys. Old Eglinton and Lansdowne would still be around. But the. Cuts of 1996 would have still taken place. I wonder if it would have been Danforth garage instead of Lansdowne that would have closed?

 

[RapidTransit]

I mean , the biggest road block to trolleys would be the actual facilities.

I assume the overhead wires would be the same as what the streetcars use? Actually streetcars use panto, so no. But we do have the overhead department at TTC.

I remember David Miller was studying to bring back trolleybuses in 2009. I wonder if a report actually came out from it. Either way, Rob Ford came in a year later.

Also, the same company that made the last trolley buses TTC had are still around today, NFI, and they still make trolley buses today. I can only imagine the improvement in technology and off during capabilities. NFI is also Canadian, fully Canadian too.

But to be honest , with the amount of traffic we have and the road designs that don't help bigger vehicles navigate the downtown area, and then to still follow a overhead wire will be annoying for operators. I get the nostalgic behind it, and love that it's actually proven technology, I just don't think it would be practical to have them.

TTC can't even get a bus garage in the old former city of Toronto, much less a garage for trolleybuses.

It would be interesting to see how things would have played out if TTC kept they're trolleys. Old Eglinton and Lansdowne would still be around. But the. Cuts of 1996 would have still taken place. I wonder if it would have been Danforth Garage instead of Lansdowne that would have closed?

 

[APTA-2048]

I do see the York university shuttle here and there. Has that been reliable? But that's different from doing 200km per day 3-4 days a week to 500 every day 6-7 days per week.

I haven’t had a chance to check them out and I don’t know anyone who has worked on them. But you’re probably right about difference in duty cycle from the TTC.

I’m not sure they’ve sold any buses in Canada since. I believe the tariff on Chinese vehicles has made that almost impossible. They still, however, exhibited at this year’s Ontario Transportation Expo. Doesn’t look like they have the factory in Newmarket anymore, though.

 

[Steve X]

I mean , the biggest road block to trolleys would be the actual facilities.

I assume the overhead wires would be the same as what the streetcars use? Actually streetcars use panto, so no. But we do have the overhead department at TTC.

I remember David Miller was studying to bring back trolleybuses in 2009. I wonder if a report actually came out from it. Either way, Rob Ford came in a year later.

Also, the same company that made the last trolley buses TTC had are still around today, NFI, and they still make trolley buses today. I can only imagine the improvement in technology and off during capabilities. NFI is also Canadian, fully Canadian too.

But to be honest , with the amount of traffic we have and the road designs that don't help bigger vehicles navigate the downtown area, and then to still follow a overhead wire will be annoying for operators. I get the nostalgic behind it, and love that it's actually proven technology, I just don't think it would be practical to have them.

TTC can't even get a bus garage in the old former city of Toronto, much less a garage for trolleybuses.

It would be interesting to see how things would have played out if TTC kept they're trolleys. Old Eglinton and Lansdowne would still be around. But the. Cuts of 1996 would have still taken place. I wonder if it would have been Danforth Garage instead of Lansdowne that would have closed?

Back then, a trolley would required it to be 100% on the grid whereas today, they can have a small battery that run the off grid for detouring or final leg of a route. They can easily dewire and rewire if proper systems in place without the operator running to the back of the bus.

This would be useful for routes like the 40 where the 40B is expanded to loop around St Clair and the 40A is extended to Kipling Station. The common section can be wired while the low usage portion would be battery operated. This would allow buses to stay out all day long.

The 2009 report came back claiming it's too expensive. You can read about it. https://www.toronto.ca/legdocs/mmis/2009/ex/bgrd/backgroundfile-21569.pdf