Toronto 137-141 Isabella Street | 231.55m | 69s | Pinedale | BDP Quadrangle

Now I can make the declaration of ‘in my back yard!’ as my partner and I have been 10+ year residents at 540 Sherbourne St. I knew something was coming last summer when the roar of a massive core sample boring truck backed into the rear of the house at 141 Isabella to do its thing. This now presents yet another tower within a three-block radius of my residence bringing the total to nearly a dozen.

During my tenure as member of the Denver, Colorado ((US) Planning Board prior to immigrating here, I was constantly aware of how a development affects neighbours and to an extent the area in which it resides/is proposed. But, it wasn’t until living in Toronto, that I can say, I comprehended the deeply emotional impact it has on a resident and the fabric of a city.

Discussions in meetings and on websites like this rise and fall in intensity, include the standard check-list topics like impact on infrastructure, traffic, environment, size and scope of the neighbourhood, viability, economics, the list is extensive. Opponents and proponents establish death-grip grasps on physical elements of projects as these documents become a foundation for an armour of evidence supporting their side or ammunition capable piercing that armour by those on the other side. The process of urbanization is inherently multi-sided and in many cases to the extent of a Libeskindesque creation. Yet despite centuries of human involvement in attempting to manage how and where we live, we have yet to conveigh the deeply emotional and personal impact it has on everyone. Because of this inability and void, everyone settles with the notion of ‘sticking to the facts,’ establishing ‘base principles,’ ‘statistical conclusions’ and historical patterns. This is clearly evidenced in the commonly rebuked ‘NIMBY’ attitude…especially as we wrestle with the double standard when that back yard becomes OUR yard.

As humans, we envision the ideal way in which we want in to live. What that constitutes is as numerous and diverse as each and everyone of us. I believe we become an ideal society when we genuinely acknowledge and embrace this diversity. When we willingly and honestly make time to listen to both the factual and emotionally-based elements of issues rather than use that time to shore—up our side preparing to fight. We can’t just put ourselves in the shoes of another as is often requested because while we may stand in the same spot, we do so maintaining our core being that comes with us.

I didn’t intend for this post to be heavy on idealism and deep thinking, as this is the start of what I’m certain will be a lengthy topic, my intent is to encourage us all to use this opportunity to genuinely consider all elements and the affect they have on others that we typically haven’t considered when sharing an opinion or comment on other topics.
 
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Send them back to the drawing board until they can come up with a plan to keep the house.
Does every old house need to be saved? Keeping this house certainly does not justify losing hundreds of units of potential housing... and I'm not sure that keeping its façade would make any sense in a new context as the front of an apartment building.
I look at this image and wonder why The Annex gets so much flak on this forum for remaining largely low-rise in proximity to multiple subway stations when Rosedale is so clearly a worse offender.
The Annex is bordered by *two* subway lines and is part of downtown. Rosedale is separated by a ravine and barely makes contact with Rosedale Station on its western edge. Not comparable. That said.... upzone them both.
 
I look at this image and wonder why The Annex gets so much flak on this forum for remaining largely low-rise in proximity to multiple subway stations when Rosedale is so clearly a worse offender.
Keeping the Annex, Rosedale and Cabbagetown for heritage can be justified. It's almost everywhere else that's questionable (most of the east and west ends, most of the outer 416, etc.).
 
Does every old house need to be saved? Keeping this house certainly does not justify losing hundreds of units of potential housing... and I'm not sure that keeping its façade would make any sense in a new context as the front of an apartment building.

The Annex is bordered by *two* subway lines and is part of downtown. Rosedale is separated by a ravine and barely makes contact with Rosedale Station on its western edge. Not comparable.

These are the homes closest to Rosedale Station on the north (opposite) side of the road):

1710016794820.png


This is the southside:

1710016827634.png


Neither are particularly historical, nor, apologies to the owners, particularly attractive. There are some much nicer homes in The Annex, I'd protect first. (by no means all of them)

The separation from Yonge/Rosedale Station is only a man-made trench w/the subway in it.

1710016934935.png



Not a huge barrier by any means, but one that could also be decked over if desired.


That said.... upzone them both.

Upzoning all of Rosedale, where much of its interior is more than 1km from any mass/rapid transit would seem as silly as rigidly protecting everything as an absolute status quo.

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There is room for nuance. I think @Mason5280 spoke well above. That is entirely possible to have some people prefer SFH housing to live in, near downtown, and many others to prefer it simply as a scenic place to walk; while it is equally possible to talk about the need to accommodate some additional housing, particularly in strategic spots, such as near subway stations; and then to seek out amicable ways to achieve that, as much as is practical. Where it is not practical, that is to say where achieving one goal inevitable compromises the other, its still possible to sympathize w/those whose wishes or needs are not being fully met.

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The pocket of Rosedale around Castle Frank station is actually much more challenging as it does have the Rosedale Valley on one side, and the Don Valley on another, and indeed the Moore Park Ravine (Brickworks) just to the north. There is certainly an argument for densifying there, but its difficult to negate the problems I just mentioned.
 
To again bring this back to the community at hand; I think any sense of historic charm on Isabella in this area is already lost, or will be when already approved proposals go ahead.

A better effort has been made on Sherbourne to preserve some of the history that survived to the new millennium and that effort should be continued. Indeed as some more contemporary and less attractive buildings come up for redevelopment, I think reconstructing some of what's been lost (facade, and first few meters of said buildings as part of a new build could add material charm.
 
I don't see a point incorporating portion of a house into a larger 69 storey development. There is a point to saving a house at the cost of hundreds of potential units. I think we've become distracted on maxing out number units over good and bad development. I don't see much of a point in saving this house. Impressions always bring me back to that bugs bunny cartoon.

Corporate signs at the tops of office towers are tacky. We're so accustomed to them here in Toronto that a building feels unfinished without one. It has generated excitement here on urbantoronto when a sign goes up on a new commercial tower. It's similar to what passes as preservation in Toronto. Sometimes we need to let it go.
 
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Concerning the house at 141 Isabella. Seeing it nearly daily for 10+ years, not once has it caused me pause to say, ‘that’s a beautiful/dynamic/inspiring/historical structure and compared to other homes in this neighbourhood, notably the dozens and dozens on Lindon and Howard Sts targeted for destruction, 141 can go and efforts should be made to protect others here.
 


137-141 Isabella Street - Community Consultation Meeting


Tuesday, April 16, 2024 6:30 PM - 8:30 PM
(UTC-04:00) Eastern Time (US & Canada)

Register for webinar
If you want to attend, register now. When your registration is approved, you'll receive an invitation to join the webinar.

Host
Carl Geiger

Agenda
City staff invite you to join a virtual Community Consultation Meeting for 137-141 Isabella Street to discuss a planning application seeking to permit a 69-storey residential building containing 823 dwelling units. The existing 7-storey apartment building and 3-storey single detached dwelling on the site would be demolished. The 61 demolished rental units would be replaced in the new proposal.

Join us at the Virtual Community Consultation Meeting to learn more about this planning application and to have your say.
 
Is this expected or surprising?

Not really.

The City is not inherently opposed to height here as seen in their approval of similar applications close by.

But the setbacks here are a real issue, among other things. The site is simply a bit tight to do what they want to do, in theory.

But as other posters have noted, its unlikely this proposal was 'real' at least in the near term, which is probably why they didn't take the time to work out the problems before filing.
 

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