Danforth Line 2 Scarborough Subway Extension

[sixrings]

Sadly when my friends and I got old enough to purchase property as much as I loved Scarborough I knew its transit was a disaster and decided to head downtown. My friends all bought property along Sheppard with the LRT in mind. In the end my friends gave up after the LRT was cancelled, didnt gain much on their property and moved further out. Sadly we rarely see each other any more since there is a distance issue but also I know some of them resent the fact my property went through the roof while they ended up having to move. But subways subways subways.

 

[OneCity]

Wanted to jump in on that point. Definitely not true on this board.

Not remotely close the same level of rage, but yes.

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

Not remotely close the same level of rage, but yes.

IMO there was less people here but there should have been. I was. The entire point was to help Sobrara property development. At least there is a human component with Scarborough. I wonder if Vaughan would have even happened if GO Transit had actually done their jobs and upgraded Barrie to full service years ago. And built Concord GO

 

[OneCity]

IMO there was less people here but there should have been. I was. The entire point was to help Sobrara property development. At least there is a human component with Scarborough. I wonder if Vaughan would have even happened if GO Transit had actually done their jobs and upgraded Barrie to full service years ago. And built Concord GO

Seriously in addition where was the media outrage? It was absolute crickets compared to what we've seen with full time political assault on the seamless connection of Scarborough Centre.

Scarborough has at least paid into the TTC for decades, actually resides in Toronto, dealt for decades with an out of place, poorly maintained RT line, has twice the population of Vaughan and already had density in the Centre unlike Vaughan, which is something for an area that was ignored since amalgamation and poorly connected to the Citys main infrastructure. Sure there are certainly valid points to be made against, moreso now with the cost and the gutting of stops (also a bi-product of the uncompromising attack). The level of hate to try to connect the Centre of such a neglected part of the City was absurd and not even comparable to the Vaughan extension. Vaughan Centre will flourish for decades to come around the subway and the good thing is they will never have to worry about debating an upgrade 30 years from now when todays costs will start to look like a steal, as will Scarborough once the air is clear and provide a far greater future to build around here.

The Provincial upload atleast give some hope and it ensures Richmond Hill wont have to deal with any lower level monkey business, or counter attacks to the DRL which would have ensued if there was any attacks. The most uneconomical and inefficient thing we can do worst we can do is fight over details and not build. A subway that connects all surrounding major Centres will be amazing and can be built alongside relief of the network exists with strong Government

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

Seriously in addition where was the media outrage? It was absolute crickets compared to what we've seen with full time political assault we've seen on the seamless connection of Scarborough Centre.

Scarborough has at least paid into the TTC for decades, actually resides in Toronto, dealt for decades with an out of place, poorly maintained RT line, has twice the population of Vaughan and already had density in the Centre unlike Vaughan, which is something for an area that was ignored since amalgamation and poorly connected to the Citys main infrastructure. Sure there are certainly valid points to be made against, moreso now with the cost and the gutting of stops (also a bi-product of the uncompromising attack). The level of hate to try to connect the Centre of such a neglected part of the City was absurd and not even comparable to the Vaughan extension. Vaughan Centre will flourish for decades to come around the subway and the good thing is they will never have to worry about debating an upgrade 30 years from now when todays costs will start to look like a steal, as will Scarborough once the air is clear and provide a far greater future to build around here.

The Provincial upload atleast give some hope and it ensures Richmond Hill wont have to deal with any lower level monkey business, or counter attacks to the DRL which would have ensued if there was any attacks. The most uneconomical and inefficient thing we can do worst we can do is fight over details and not build. A subway that connects all surrounding major Centres will be amazing and can be built alongside relief of the network exists with strong Government

I think it was just the general backlash against Vaughan combined with Scarborough negative reputation. Here, you are right. Vaughan had a poor transit system before 2000 and a lot of what is there now was farm and brown fields.

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

I think it was just the general backlash against Vaughan combined with Scarborough negative reputation. Here, you are right. Vaughan had a poor transit system before 2000 and a lot of what is there now was farm and brown fields.

And just another thing, the YRT outside of Viva is so poor as well. Scarborough has much better bus transit.

 

[pstogios]

Seriously in addition where was the media outrage? It was absolute crickets compared to what we've seen with full time political assault on the seamless connection of Scarborough Centre.
...

The level of hate to try to connect the Centre of such a neglected part of the City was absurd

God you’re such a psychopath!

There is NO HATE. Get some professional help for your psychosis - nobody hates Scarborough!

You’ve turned this thread and a SECOND THREAD for more than 1000 pages into endless diatribes and attacks against rationality, logic and evidence-based transit. To you it’s all politics and conspiracy. Are you Donald Trump? For nearly 1000 pages this is a battle betweeen coffey1 and the rest of the world.

It’s GRATING!

The TYSSE was a politically-motivated endeavour that is not supported by density, ridership, destinations, built form, and potential for development. It should never have been built.

The SSE is a politically-motivated endeavour that is not supported by density, ridership, destinations, built form and potential for development. It should never be built.

THATS IT. FULL STOP.

NO HATRED for Scarborough!

 

[syn]

Sadly when my friends and I got old enough to purchase property as much as I loved Scarborough I knew its transit was a disaster and decided to head downtown. My friends all bought property along Sheppard with the LRT in mind. In the end my friends gave up after the LRT was cancelled, didnt gain much on their property and moved further out. Sadly we rarely see each other any more since there is a distance issue but also I know some of them resent the fact my property went through the roof while they ended up having to move. But subways subways subways.

Rob and Doug ruined all of your friendships!

 

[syn]

God you’re such a psychopath!

There is NO HATE. Get some professional help for your psychosis - nobody hates Scarborough!

You’ve turned this thread and a SECOND THREAD for more than 1000 pages into endless diatribes and attacks against rationality, logic and evidence-based transit. To you it’s all politics and conspiracy. Are you Donald Trump? For nearly 1000 pages this is a battle betweeen coffey1 and the rest of the world.

It’s GRATING!

The TYSSE was a politically-motivated endeavour that is not supported by density, ridership, destinations, built form, and potential for development. It should never have been built.

The SSE is a politically-motivated endeavour that is not supported by density, ridership, destinations, built form and potential for development. It should never be built.

THATS IT. FULL STOP.

NO HATRED for Scarborough!

It's unfortunate that entire arguments and relevant facts are dismissed with 'hate'.

I'd love to see Scarborough get great transit - selfishly as someone who travels there, and for friends that live there.

This extension and the investment required certainly doesn't qualify.

 

[Rainforest]

SSE will greatly improve the connectivity between Scarborough and the rest of the city. Even though some people are continuously trying to deny that.

Regarding the attitudes: I don't see anyone hating Scarborough; I do see a group of posters that are arrogant and snobbish and make themselves feel important by telling Scarberians they aren't qualified for a subway.

 

[CapitalSeven]

Qualified? How is that a relevant concept? Unless this project isn't about transportation and how it can be best and most efficiently delivered, but rather about class warfare and settling grudges.

 

[44 North]

SSE will greatly improve the connectivity between Scarborough and the rest of the city. Even though some people are continuously trying to deny that.

Regarding the attitudes: I don't see anyone hating Scarborough; I do see a group of posters that are arrogant and snobbish and make themselves feel important by telling Scarberians they aren't qualified for a subway.

Yeah but define greatly, because on the whole we're really just talking about the removal of a transfer here. Now I don't want to be lumped in with other posters, or pigeonholed into being some anti-Scarboro anti-subway person. Far from it. Line 2 or Line 4 extensions in Scarb are generally fine, however abandoning something like Line 3, its current stations, and a somewhat protected ROW for extension... not so much. IMO at least. That's solid infrastructure.

Regardless we are just talking about a transfer. Similar could be said of Sheppard/Yonge, St George, Bloor/Yonge, future RL transfer @ Pape, or if instead of TYSSE we put a line-to-line transfer at Downsview to another separate subway line (not unlike Line 2-Line 3). Had we done the latter in that list would it really "greatly" improve connectivity between NW North York + Vaughan, or just be a somewhat minor inconvenience? Likely the latter since it's just a transfer, and at the end of the day you still get a subway - one with more stations to boot.

 

[pstogios]

Regarding the attitudes: I don't see anyone hating Scarborough

You might want to explain how you have come to that conclusion to coffey/Onecity. Because to him, any others that respond to demagogues like the Fords, only see conspiracy against them.

The rest of us only see the data. Data that clearly shows there are other areas of the city have the ridership, density, destinations, established and ongoing development and built form that is more suitable to higher order transit.

 

[OneCity]

Yeah but define greatly, because on the whole we're really just talking about the removal of a transfer here. Now I don't want to be lumped in with other posters, or pigeonholed into being some anti-Scarboro anti-subway person. Far from it. Line 2 or Line 4 extensions in Scarb are generally fine, however abandoning something like Line 3, its current stations, and a somewhat protected ROW for extension... not so much. IMO at least. That's solid infrastructure.

Regardless we are just talking about a transfer. Similar could be said of Sheppard/Yonge, St George, Bloor/Yonge, future RL transfer @ Pape, or if instead of TYSSE we put a line-to-line transfer at Downsview to another separate subway line (not unlike Line 2-Line 3). Had we done the latter in that list would it really "greatly" improve connectivity between NW North York + Vaughan, or just be a somewhat minor inconvenience? Likely the latter since it's just a transfer, and at the end of the day you still get a subway - one with more stations to boot.

Thankfully we'll no longer have to question such an ill placed transfer before the planned Central Growth node. The other transfers you mention are completely different in purpose and pushing the subway transfer(s)to Scarborough Centre make far more sense. Transferring at SCC make far greater sense.

The LRT didn't need to have a transfer and the BDL could have used the old corridor if there was a willingness of some outside councillors to find improvements or compromise. While the transfer was then main problem with the line, its not like there werent other glaring issues as the alignment runs along a unpopulated rail corridor. Once the stops are added it will be more than a solid piece of infrastructure, it will be great. Unfortunate a few outside councillors choose not to care what many residents here thought about for the transfer placement or the dis-jointed, out of place line or the greater concerns on Sheppard. Improvements and compromise could have been found and was certainly offered. Transit City was a very flawed transit plan.

 

[BurlOak]

The LRT didn't need to have a transfer and the BDL could have used the old corridor if there was a willingness of some outside councillors to find improvements or compromise. While the transfer was then main problem with the line, its not like there werent other glaring issues as the alignment runs along a unpopulated rail corridor. Once the stops are added it will be more than a solid piece of infrastructure, it will be great. Unfortunate a few outside councillors choose not to care what many residents here thought about for the transfer placement or the dis-jointed, out of place line or the greater concerns on Sheppard. Improvements and compromise could have been found and was certainly offered. Transit City was a very flawed transit plan.

Since about 2012, the entire transit plan for Toronto has been to achieve the goal of defeating Ford. You can't expect to get the best when this is your goal.

btw, I wonder what happened to that "subway safety" poster.
I was hoping that after receiving that questionable time-out we could get more information about her ideas.