Cycling infrastructure (Separated bike lanes)

[robmausser]

There was supposed to be protected bike lane... Then they opted for paint... I'm not sure the lane is even painted yet. Such a waste given the huge boulevards along that stretch.

I just rode it the other day. Where the street and curb work is done, there is a white strip of paint. Otherwise there is nothing but orange cones.

 

[robmausser]

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Posted this in the crosstown thread but I think it should be here as well

Its really a mess that they chose to have the city and Metrolinx do the bike lanes at different parts. It changes in style so much throughout the route, from protected cycle lanes to bike lanes with curbs to white paint.

 

[youngblood]

It doesnt make sense to have cycle tracks only at the stations, but I guess it was a way for the city to get metrolinx to pay for it

 

[DSC]

They are installing a 'raised bus stop" on the new section of The Esplanade track just west of Lower Sherbourne, good idea!

 

[Andy_in_Toronto]

They are installing a 'raised bus stop" on the new section of The Esplanade track just west of Lower Sherbourne, good idea!

I saw installation of this raised bus stop biking by today. Basically, the same modular bus waiting platform that can been seen on King St. However, so far I’m impressed by the cycle track installation on the Esplanade. Mill St. cycles tracks also received upgrades. Finally, we have a cycling engineer and implementation team at the city who are doing great work if no red tape or politics are interfering.

 

[robmausser]

I saw installation of this raised bus stop biking by today. Basically, the same modular bus waiting platform that can been seen on King St. However, so far I’m impressed by the cycle track installation on the Esplanade. Mill St. cycles tracks also received upgrades. Finally, we have a cycling engineer and implementation team at the city who are doing great work if no red tape or politics are interfering.

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Im really getting sick of those white posts. They are ugly and they do nothing to actually protect bikers. They are just an anti-getting-sued device when some moron driver wrecks his undercarriage because they cant deal with a curb.

 

[Towered]

Im really getting sick of those white posts. They are ugly and they do nothing to actually protect bikers. They are just an anti-getting-sued device when some moron driver wrecks his undercarriage because they cant deal with a curb.

I'd like to see the slightly taller concrete dividers that you see on Lansdowne south of Dundas for example. No ugly white floppy things needed.

 

[TossYourJacket]

I'd like to see the slightly taller concrete dividers that you see on Lansdowne south of Dundas for example. No ugly white floppy things needed.

But those might damage some moron's BMW and preventing that is the city's real priority unfortunately.

 

[Northern Light]

But those might damage some moron's BMW and preventing that is the city's real priority unfortunately.

I agree w/the desire for more substantive barriers. But you're wrong to bury staff for not installing them for the reason noted above.

Its much more a cost issue; as well as a practical question for routes w/curbside garbage pickup and such.

Trust me, the cycling unit is made up of people right now who cycle all the time; and use these same lanes. They want to achieve the maximum they can.

But they still have budgets and political masters and constrained timelines.

That said, look at all the projects up for delivery over the next 12 months that are set to have enhanced physical separation.

You'll be seeing a lot more of that in the years ahead.

 

[DSC]

I agree w/the desire for more substantive barriers. But you're wrong to bury staff for not installing them for the reason noted above.

Its much more a cost issue; as well as a practical question for routes w/curbside garbage pickup and such.

Trust me, the cycling unit is made up of people right now who cycle all the time; and use these same lanes. They want to achieve the maximum they can.

But they still have budgets and political masters and constrained timelines.

That said, look at all the projects up for delivery over the next 12 months that are set to have enhanced physical separation.

You'll be seeing a lot more of that in the years ahead.

And The Esplanade track will be rebuilt in next 18 months as David Crombie Park rehab moves forward.

 

[H4F33Z]

Im really getting sick of those white posts. They are ugly and they do nothing to actually protect bikers. They are just an anti-getting-sued device when some moron driver wrecks his undercarriage because they cant deal with a curb.

It's arguably the ideal type of separation for the route, and how narrow the street is. It's kind of a feat that the entire route is physically protected with curbs for what is a collector/neighbourhood road. Other cities or even Toronto just a few years ago would've just put sharrows and called it a day.

Also, it's a quick-build design, this gets the project done in days rather than months or even years. This is efficient design that is flexible, cost-effective and yet effective for improving safety. And who says they can't improve it in the future?

This was literally mentioned in their presentation.

A lot of nit-pick cycling advocates really love to whine (I was one of them) but these staff work really hard to get this work done. I was talking to a few people from transportation and the ped/cycling unit yesterday and they're all really cool people, and they have so much projects they're working on currently and tons they have in the pipeline. They want a protected cycling network just like we do, and they have many projects that kinda made me excited to hear is coming to fruition, it might take some time, but they're going to make it happen.

I think it's fair to complain about terrible and dangerous road design but let's not undermine or even trash the hard-work that the many engineers and design staff have done to build a new, what is a really good protected cycling route. They're doing their best!

Hopefully this doesn't come off as rude.

 

[Northern Light]

It's arguably the ideal type of separation for the route, and how narrow the street is. It's kind of a feat that the entire route is physically protected with curbs for what is a collector/neighbourhood road. Other cities or even Toronto just a few years ago would've just put sharrows and called it a day.

Also, it's a quick-build design, this gets the project done in days rather than months or even years. This is efficient design that is flexible, cost-effective and yet effective for improving safety. And who says they can't improve it in the future?

This was literally mentioned in their presentation.

View attachment 402893
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A lot of nit-pick cycling advocates really love to whine (I was one of them) but these staff work really hard to get this work done. I was talking to a few people from transportation and the ped/cycling unit yesterday and they're all really cool people, and they have so much projects they're working on currently and tons they have in the pipeline. They want a protected cycling network just like we do, and they have many projects that kinda made me excited to hear is coming to fruition, it might take some time, but they're going to make it happen.

I think it's fair to complain about terrible and dangerous road design but let's not undermine or even trash the hard-work that the many engineers and design staff have done to build a new, what is a really good protected cycling route. They're doing their best!

Hopefully this doesn't come off as rude.

Excellent post!

Edit to add; I don't have a problem w/people nitpicking per se; or wanting what they perceive to be the best; I just think its important to be aware that the professional staff here are true believers, cyclists and doing their very best.

 

[robmausser]

It's arguably the ideal type of separation for the route, and how narrow the street is. It's kind of a feat that the entire route is physically protected with curbs for what is a collector/neighbourhood road. Other cities or even Toronto just a few years ago would've just put sharrows and called it a day.

Also, it's a quick-build design, this gets the project done in days rather than months or even years. This is efficient design that is flexible, cost-effective and yet effective for improving safety. And who says they can't improve it in the future?

This was literally mentioned in their presentation.

View attachment 402893
View attachment 402895

A lot of nit-pick cycling advocates really love to whine (I was one of them) but these staff work really hard to get this work done. I was talking to a few people from transportation and the ped/cycling unit yesterday and they're all really cool people, and they have so much projects they're working on currently and tons they have in the pipeline. They want a protected cycling network just like we do, and they have many projects that kinda made me excited to hear is coming to fruition, it might take some time, but they're going to make it happen.

I think it's fair to complain about terrible and dangerous road design but let's not undermine or even trash the hard-work that the many engineers and design staff have done to build a new, what is a really good protected cycling route. They're doing their best!

Hopefully this doesn't come off as rude.

I'm sorry, unlike another poster I didnt mean I wanted something better like those huge concrete barriers at Lakeshore. I think the concrete curb is fine, and the flexiposts and large barriers are totally overkill.

 

[DSC]

I'm sorry, unlike another poster I didnt mean I wanted something better like those huge concrete barriers at Lakeshore. I think the concrete curb is fine, and the flexiposts and large barriers are totally overkill.

I think there are two kinds of (or uses of) the flexi-posts. One is where they are screwed directly to the road and if a vehicle goes over them the posts flex and the vehicle is in the bike track. They are really rather useless but better that just paint. They allow (encourage?) garbage and delivery vehicles to use bike lanes. Then there are the flexi posts attached to concrete curbs or one size or another to reinforce the fact that there are curbs and neither bikes nor cars should cross them. They warn both bike and vehicles that there are 'things' on the road. These certainly warn-off more vehicles and are a reminder the cyclists too. I think that both uses have their positive points if the locations are carefully chosen. Of course, in an ideal world where one is starting with a clean slate, there should be much better separations of bikes, vehicle and pedestrians and they would look better but installing bike routes into an existing environment will require compromises.

EDIT: Where a street is wide enough they put planters not poles to delineate the line of concrete curbs - Mill Street east of Parliament is a good example. The still put the flexi-posts at the end of each section to be sure they are visible - we all know how blind motorists can be!

 

[robmausser]

I think there are two kinds of (or uses of) the flexi-posts. One is where they are screwed directly to the road and if a vehicle goes over them the posts flex and the vehicle is in the bike track. They are really rather useless but better that just paint. They allow (encourage?) garbage and delivery vehicles to use bike lanes. Then there are the flexi posts attached to concrete curbs or one size or another to reinforce the fact that there are curbs and neither bikes nor cars should cross them. They warn both bike and vehicles that there are 'things' on the road. These certainly warn-off more vehicles and are a reminder the cyclists too. I think that both uses have their positive points if the locations are carefully chosen. Of course, in an ideal world where one is starting with a clean slate, there should be much better separations of bikes, vehicle and pedestrians and they would look better but installing bike routes into an existing environment will require compromises.

EDIT: Where a street is wide enough they put planters not poles to delineate the line of concrete curbs - Mill Street east of Parliament is a good example. The still put the flexi-posts at the end of each section to be sure they are visible - we all know how blind motorists can be!

Sorry, but I hate all of them. They are ugly and unsightly and just add to a dirty polluted cheap plastic atmosphere in a city that is already a pretty visually soulless concrete jungle already.